Regina Doherty (Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister of State for coming to the Seanad to discuss this issue. I compliment her on the work she has done in recent months. It is truly refreshing to see the proactivity and the new approach that is being taken in the Department with regard to specials needs. I wish her every success. I know the Seanad will continue to support her.

I wish to raise the issue of the urgent need for provision of a permanent school building for St. Michael's House Special National School in Skerries, north County Dublin. It is a co-educational special school under the patronage of St. Michael's House, with 30 pupils, many of whom have a diagnosis of autism or are on the ASD spectrum. Some of them have very complex additional needs. For many years, work has been under way to build a permanent and purpose-built school and home for St. Michael's.It is currently based in a very old converted house and faces all of the challenges that come with that, mainly being overcrowded and always oversubscribed. With the support of the Department, the school is currently at stage 1 of the design and build process and is hoping to move on to the next stage early in the new year. A very successful and long meeting was held yesterday, which gave some succour. This is a hugely important milestone and is an impressive achievement for a small school at this stage.

While we are all pleased to see this part of the build process moving forward, there is an issue, a blocking and an impediment when it comes to the site acquisition. This process has been under way for four years now, but unfortunately seems to have completely stalled in the Chief State Solicitor's office. I want to ensure this delay does not begin to impact on the subsequent stages of the design and build process, which we will now move into. We need action on this now. The site acquisition needs approval and sign-off and that needs to be done now. We have waiting for far too long. The school has enormous support in the community. The Minister of State will know from her work over the last few months and visiting special schools that they are taken into the hearts and minds of the people who live around them and it is no different in Skerries. All sides are in favour of the purchase of the site and so there should be no issues. The delays in the Chief State Solicitor's office are proving quite disappointing.

The future of St. Michael's House in Skerries is bright. Its transformation from an old house to a 16-classroom purpose-built campus will do wonders not just for the area, but for all the pupils and their families. It will greatly enhance the school experience for those students and their families. It will also allow the school to cater for students with more serious and profound needs in our community. At the moment the school is constricted to those with moderate needs and the children with more severe needs have to be sent outside of their own community.

I am grateful that the Department has been so supportive of this project in recent times and I look forward to that support continuing. The completion of the site acquisition process should remove the last of any significant challenges we face in getting this school built and getting boots on the ground. I urge the Minister of State to sign off on it as soon as possible. I thank my local councillor, Tom O’Leary for highlighting this issue. I note in particular the dedication of the principal, Karen Byrne, who joined the school in 2018, and her predecessor Pat Price. The members of the board of management are all local and have given much time and commitment to this long sought after project. We want to see it come to fruition. We want to see a happy outcome and for any obstacles in the Chief State Solicitor's office to be addressed and cleared in order that we can move on to stages 2 and 3 and get this school built.

Josepha Madigan (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)
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I thank Senator Doherty for her strong interest in the area of special education. She has always been a very strong advocate in this area and I appreciate the work she has done to date, particularly in trying to bring this school into the spotlight. As she noted, there was a very long and productive meeting on this matter yesterday.

As regards the site acquisition, I understand there are some small issues in the Chief State Solicitor's office that still need to be rectified. I assure the Senator that as Minister of State with responsibility for special education, I will be speaking with the Department about this on a regular basis to ensure it does not delay the acquisition of the site any further. There are sometimes complex legal issues that need to be sorted out when dealing with a site acquisition of this nature. We want to ensure there is no delay in this project progressing to planning and in order for there to be no delay, that needs to be sorted out. The site acquisition is in the process of being finalised by Fingal County Council and no issues are anticipated, other than the small issues arising through the Chief State Solicitor's office. Meanwhile, the design work is continuing and stage 1 work has commenced, which includes things like site investigation, site suitability and the design options. On 16 December, I received the very first submission report. We are now reviewing that and we will then come back to the board of management of the school. There is also an external professional project manager in place to co-ordinate all the various components of a project of this nature.

The Senator has quite eloquently set out the school and its main purpose, which is to provide an educational facility for children with special needs. From an overall perspective, I am pleased that this school will be moving to Hacketstown, which is in the immediate environs of the St. Michael's House Special National School in Skerries. It will provide 16 classrooms and two ASD classes. There will be a new deputy principal's office, a nurse's office and a multisensory room. I visited St. Martin de Porres National School in Tallaght this morning and it would really like a multisensory room. That will be provided in this instance, as will a home economics room. The design team was appointed in May 2020 and it has done a significant amount of work since that date. The architect, the quantity surveyor, the civil and structural engineer, the mechanical and electrical engineer and all the others have worked hard to present this stage 1 submission report to the Department, and we are currently reviewing it.

The needs of children with special needs is of paramount importance to me and I appreciate the Senator's comments at the outset of her contribution. This is the very first time there has been a Minister of State with responsibility for special education and we are getting €2 billion, or one fifth, of the overall departmental budget. That is badly needed in order that we can ensure children with special needs receive exactly the same type of education as children without special needs. That is the bottom line and we cannot have them in a building that is sub-optimal or is not providing them a proper service or a proper education.

Regina Doherty (Fine Gael)
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It is heartwarming to hear how much attention and personal commitment the Minister of State will give this matter. One can see from the level of detail and ambition that has been put into the design in stage 1 of the process how ambitious the staff, the families and the community are for the students in this school. Of course we want the absolute best for our children. We want to be able to expand that service. I am grateful for the update the Minister of State has given me and for the attention and the level of detail she is going to give those issues that still remain in the Chief State Solicitor's office. I hope we can get over them very quickly.

I do not mean to put her on the spot but does the Minister of State have any idea of the timelines we could be looking at to move to stage 2 and stage 3, to get the school doors open? That would give some hope and some renewed impetus to the people who have been working so hard.

On a wider issue, would it be possible to conduct a review of special educational needs across the wider Fingal area? We have an awful lot of schools that do not have ASD units but definitely have special needs children. Would the Minister of State consider doing a special audit across Fingal?

Josepha Madigan (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)
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In the Senator's original contribution she noted that the school was in an old converted building. That is below par for children with special needs so from an overall perspective, it is going to be of benefit to those 30 children, and hopefully more, when they move to the new building in Hacketstown.

From a timeline perspective, as a solicitor and lawyer I know things can get bogged down in legal detail and that can take time. I am not in a position to give the Senator an exact timeline but suffice it to say I will be giving this matter my absolute attention. It will be prioritised as far as I am concerned and we will be closely connecting with the Chief State Solicitor over the next number of months and weeks to see if we can expedite the process. The Chief State Solicitor obviously has to be satisfied that all components and the rigour of the law are tested before moving to the next stage. I will give this my full attention.

As regards a review, the National Council for Special Education will undertake a review of all areas but I will ask it to look at Fingal in particular and to ensure we have enough special classes and ASD units. There are 200 building projects going out in 2021 and 111 of those will provide ASD units. Obviously, if there is a deficit in Fingal I will look at that very closely.

Sharon Keogan (Independent)
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I thank Senator Doherty for raising this question. I know of the great work Karen Byrne, the principal of that school, does. It is an important subject for all those in special education. I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Madigan, for coming in and wish her and her family a very happy Christmas.