Nicole Ryan (Sinn Fein)
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I welcome the Minister to the House.

Diarmuid Wilson (Fianna Fail)
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I move:

“That Seanad Éireann:

recognises that: - Irish people take great pride in our Defence Forces and the contribution made by the Permanent Defence Force, the Reserve Defence Force and by Civil Defence;

- the single greatest asset the Defence Forces has is its personnel; and

welcomes:

- significant progress on pay for the Defence Forces with the most recent increase awarded in August 2025;

- payment of recruits on completion of training of €41,880 in Year 1, a 51 per cent increase since 2019;

- payment of a Cadet on commissioning is €45,795, a 48 per cent increase from 2019;

- payment for a graduate entrant on commissioning beginning at €51,184;

- the extension of private medical care to all ranks in the Defence Forces;

- the extension of the Service Commitment Scheme for Air Corps pilots to Air Traffic Controllers;

- provision of fitness, training and sports facilities across its installations;

- a doubling of the Patrol Duty allowance;

- the extension of the Naval Service tax credit for a further five years;

- the implementation of a payment to Officer Instructors in the Defence Forces;

- the increase in the maximum age of retirement to 62 and the age of recruitment for General Service/Cadets to 39, and to 50 for Direct Entry specialists;

- the commencement of the application of the Working Time Directive across the Defence Forces in January 2025;

- the Joint Induction Training Centre in Gormanston which, when fully operational, will enable training to be provided to 900 recruits per annum;

- the establishment of a Retention Team in the Defence Forces to start building a clear pathway to reduce overall attrition;

- the development of a Defence Forces Strategic Workforce Plan; and further welcomes: - the appointment of the first female Minister for Defence;

- the significant increase in the Defence Budget in recent years; and acknowledges: - the ongoing staffing challenges in the Defence Forces;

- that, as of 30th November, 2025, total numbers in the Defence Forces stood at 7,715 personnel or 79 per cent of an agreed establishment strength of 9,739;

- the challenge of meeting the Commission on Defence Forces recommended target of 11,500 personnel by 2028; and calls for: - an evaluation of the Public Service Pensions (Single Scheme and Other Provisions) Act 2012 with regard to its impact on retention in the Defence Forces;

- the disparity in pension entitlements for personnel who enlisted post 1994 and pre 2024 to be addressed;

- the appointment of an adjudicator to the Conciliation and Arbitration Scheme for the Permanent Defence Forces;

- Defence Forces Chaplains and the Director of Military Prosecutions to be allowed to avail of membership of a representative association;

- the commencement of adjustments to pay and allowances as agreed under the local bargaining arrangements of the Public Service Pay Agreement 2024-2026;

- the establishment of a Specialist Pay Review Body, outside of local bargaining provisions, to consider the appropriateness of current rates of technical pay to specialists;

- improvements in initial Cadet pay;

- a review of the current duty pay system;

- implementation of the third strand of the Working Time Directive;

- examination of the introduction of Long Service Increments; and

- the introduction of the rank of Lance Corporal.”

I will be sharing time with Senator Gallagher.

Nicole Ryan (Sinn Fein)
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Is that agreed? Agreed.

Diarmuid Wilson (Fianna Fail)
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I welcome the Minister, Deputy McEntee, to the House. This is the first opportunity I have had to do so in her new capacity as Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade and Minister for Defence. I wish her well in the years ahead in that position.

I welcome the opportunity to speak on an issue that goes to the very foundation of our sovereignty and security. It is a topic we do not debate sufficiently, but we can be proud in this Chamber that we speak about it more often than most. We do so with the benefit of extensive experience and considerable knowledge from Seanad colleagues who have served in the Defence Forces at various ranks and in one case in more than one defence force.

Defence debates in this place are rational, informed and grounded in the realities of today's world. I have no doubt that this will be the case again today. At its heart, defence is about our responsibility as a nation to safeguard our people, protect our democracy and contribute credibly to peace and security at home and abroad. Let us be clear, Ireland's security environment has changed profoundly. The world we face in 2026 is more complex and unpredictable than at any time since the Cold War. We see it in Russia's continued aggression in eastern Europe, the bloodshed and horrors in Gaza and the West Bank, instability in north Africa, the growth in hybrid warfare, cyber threats and mass disinformation. The recent threats to Greenland from those in the current US Administration serve to add to a growing and alarming number of challenges to small open democracies like ours.

Defence is integral to national resilience, economic security and, increasingly, the protection of our democratic institutions. In recent years, Ireland has experienced cyberattacks on critical infrastructure and interference with undersea cables that carry the digital lifeblood of our economy. We have seen Irish airspace and waters regularly transited by foreign military activity. We have witnessed how hybrid tactics, economic and informational, are used to test the will of small states like ours.

Against that backdrop, I again acknowledge the work of the Commission on the Defence Forces and the Government's decision to move to level of ambition 2. Many of us in this House would like to see us move further and faster to level of ambition 3. With these caveats, I think we can say we are, for the first time in a decade, on the pathway to credible capability growth. Recruitment, pay reform, modernisation of infrastructure and investment in new maritime, cyber and air assets are not luxuries; they are obligations.

However, we must also be honest with ourselves that the Defence Forces are still under enormous strain. Although there is a willing pool of available talent, recruitment remains below target, retention is fragile and morale has been tested. The good intentions of successive Ministers must be translated into clear measurable improvements. These include better remuneration, structured career paths and tangible respect for service. We must also be careful about how some pay rates are presented, for example, the rates of cadet and recruit pay. While we often hear the figures of €45,000 or €51,000 being bandied about as an impressive rate of pay for cadets, that is only paid after completion of training. The cadet in actual training earns around €25,000 in year one and €28,000 in year two. These are people in their early and mid-20s. They potentially have mortgages and a family, and they definitely have responsibilities. How many of us could commit to two years on that income? The situation is no better among general service recruits.

On retention, we have a major issue with the post-2013 pension terms.This is across all services, but it has to be addressed urgently.

I could list several other glaring anomalies, from the unevenness of the service commitment scheme, which still does not cover all air traffic controllers, to the outrageous situation where local bargaining payments under the current pay agreement are now six months overdue in some cases. The fact progress is so slow on these and other issues sends the wrong message entirely to serving personnel. We need a lot more action from the Department and this action must be politically driven from across the Cabinet. The men and women of Óglaigh na hÉireann serve with distinction at home and on UN missions abroad. They deserve a 21st century organisation worthy of their commitment. We have done much and that has to be acknowledged, but we have a lot more to do. The motion before us today makes note of this important fact.

An expanded Defence Forces that numbers more than 11,500 personnel deserves the best facilities and accommodation. We must look seriously at expanding our barracks facilities today to accommodate further expansion of the Defence Forces. We should develop new facilities and re-open some closed ones, not least Dún Uí Néill, the former army barracks in Cavan town, which was closed in 2012. Dún Uí Néill was the only purpose-built army barracks ever built in the history of the State. It was closed in 2012 and that was a desperately short-sighted decision. It should be reopened immediately. I will deal with that in this House at a later date.

A credible defence policy is built not only on personnel, but also on technology. The world of 2026 demands secure communications, resilient data systems and surveillance capacity that matches our maritime responsibilities, which extend over 1 million sq. km of ocean. To put it simply, our approach to our national defence must be rooted in sustainable investment, better governance and a culture of respect from the Cabinet table to operational command. Our generation must ensure Ireland's defence posture matches the realities of our time. It must be grounded in our values, but realistic about the threats we face.

Members of the Defence Forces do their duty daily. They do it without fanfare and with the utmost professionalism and courage. It is our duty as legislators to give them the resources, respect and clarity of vision they deserve.

Robbie Gallagher (Fianna Fail)
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I second the motion. Cuirim fáilte roimh an Aire go dtí an Teach seo inniu. Like Senator Wilson, this is the first opportunity I have had to converse with her in the Chamber and I wish her well in her new role.

I take this opportunity to thank the men and women of the Defence Forces for their excellent service to the country at home and abroad. They do us proud every time they put on their uniforms and we are deeply indebted to them and their families for their service to the State.

It is fair to say the Minister has inherited a brief in which there has been chronic underfunding for many years and that has to be taken on board. The recent budget announcement of almost €1.5 billion is a step in the right direction. Until now, the waters, to use a phrase, were calmer in the geopolitical situation. Unfortunately, as we all know too well, that situation has now changed dramatically and what we got away with heretofore will not cut the mustard going forward. Clearly we have a lot of time to make up on what needs to be done not to be classified as the weak link of Europe for our defence situation. If we compare ourselves with such countries as Denmark and Finland, we are a long way behind. Either Denmark or Finland's budget allocation this year was something like €7 billion. That shows that we have a long way to go in that regard.

The recent goings on with Russian submarines shadowing our waters and the recent drone attack during the President of Ukraine's visit to this country highlight that we need to be on our game when it comes to the security of our island and we also have an obligation to our EU colleagues to play our part.

There have been recent changes to the terms and conditions of Defence Forces members, which are to be welcomed. Our ambition is to reach 11,500 by 2028. We have a long way to go in that regard. We are currently at a figure of approximately 7,700 so we have a lot of work to do to catch up. Again, I take this opportunity to thank both representative bodies, Permanent Defence Force Other Ranks Representative Association, PDFORRA, and Representative Association of Commissioned Officers, RACO, for the excellent work they do on behalf of their members. They advocate for them and have made a good job of that. There have been welcome changes in recent times in relation to pay, the working time directive and a number of other issues that have helped the situation.

The recent interest in the recruitment advertising is encouraging and it is important that we, as the Government, recognises the unique role members of the Defence Forces play in their daily duty. Unlike in many other occupations, they put their lives at risk when they go about their duties and that has to be recognised as a special occupation. Therefore, it is important the Government listen to the representative bodies, PDFORRA and RACO, when they advocate on behalf of their members.

I acknowledge the record budget allocation this year of almost €1.5 billion. It is welcome and needed and we look forward to that budget increasing year on year to make up for the periods of underinvestment down through the years. It is all very well recruiting people to the Defence Forces, but when we do, it is important we are able to hold on to them. Retention is an important issue. There are problems that affect the members whom we need to listen to.

One of those problems is the disparity in the pension entitlements for personnel who enlisted after 1994 and before 2024. That needs to be addressed. It is an issue that not only affects members of the Defence Forces but strays onto members of An Garda Síochána and the fire service as well. That is just one of many issues that need to be addressed. It is important to recognise it is a unique occupation and we need to be cognisant of that. When the representative bodies advocate on behalf of their membership, they are making legitimate claims that deserve to be listened to. They have been banging the drum for many years. The members of the Defence Forces have been speaking with their feet because many of them did not find it to be a recognisable, long-term occupation and those who did join found that the terms and conditions were such that, as my colleague Senator Wilson said, they could not see themselves supporting their families for a long number of years on the income they had. There has been some progress. Much more needs to be done, but I know the Minister will grasp that because what brings this all into focus is that we will take up the EU Presidency in July this year. It is a high-risk situation and one we need to be cognisant of.

We will not beef up our defences within the next six months.That is not credible. It is not going to happen. As we have done in this country for many years, we need to depend on our good neighbours in the UK, who have been and are providing security for this State, the detail of which I do not have. It has been a long-running arrangement. We will need to reach out to them and colleagues in the EU to help us to get through this EU Presidency because it is a high-risk situation that we do not want to be left feeling embarrassed about. I thank the Minister for her attendance, acknowledge the work that has been done and recognise that much more needs to be done for us to have a defence system that the people of this country deserve.

Gerard Craughwell (Independent)
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I move amendment No. 1:

After “acknowledges:”, to insert the following paragraphs: “- Ireland’s naval defences are very weak, and the Government has not ordered any new naval ships;

- there is a lack of strategic thinking on the part of the Government, and this has reduced our capability;

- many members of the Defence Forces do not get private health care or only receive a few benefits;

- Cadets like many in the Defence Forces are underpaid - during training they only get paid €22,000 and after training they will earn less than €40,000;

- there must be the implementation of a payment to Officer Instructors in the Defence Forces;

- retirement benefits in the Defence Forces have got worse in recent years;

- the Government must invest in the Reserve Defence Force;”

Gerard Craughwell (Independent)
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I welcome the Minister to the House. I speak to her as a former member of the Defence Forces and as a nominee of PDFORRA, RACO and the security services in general. The current allowable strength of the Defence Forces is 9,739, all ranks, across all services - Army, Air Corps and Naval Service. The actual strength of the forces on 31 December 2025 was 7,700, which is 2,039 personnel, or 21%, below strength. The net increase in strength from 31 December 2024 to 31 December 2025 was 143 personnel. These facts are alarming against the background of global and European geopolitical insecurity and turmoil. This is not something that political Ireland or the Department of Defence should be proud of.

The 2022 Commission on the Defence Forces recommended a target strength of the Defence Forces of 11,500 by 2028. I believe in a recent briefing from the Department, the Minister was told that, with the slow rate of increase, it would take five years to reach 9,739 and up to ten years to reach 11,500, the targeted strength. This suggests it will be 2035 at the earliest when the target will be achieved. Both suggested dates are fanciful in the extreme. In recent years, in order to drive recruitment, pay rates for initial entrants have been significantly increased for newly commissioned officers and private soldier recruits on finishing initial training. Retention of middle-ranking personnel, commissioned and non-commissioned, is the lifeblood of the organisation. These inflated pay rates for new entrants have substantially narrowed the gap between top pay for private soldiers and the maximum rates for corporals and sergeants, the mid-ranking personnel the forces are most eager to retain.

Similarly, with commissioned officers, front-loading the pay of second lieutenants and lieutenants significantly reduced the pay differential between the captains and commandants and their maximum rate. Middle-ranking captains, commandants, corporals and sergeants, the ones most needed to be retained in service, are now disincentivised due to the sleight of hand in raising the most junior ranks' pay to the disadvantage of ranks immediately above them. The starting salary for an officer cadet is €25,493. When we bear in mind we are trying to attract people, some of whom are married, €25,000 does not exactly do it. The first point on the scale for a commissioned officer is approximately €31,000.

The introduction, as my colleagues pointed out, of the single pension Act in 2013 proves that one size does not fit all. Without going into great detail, the single pension Act is now severely impacting all front-line services, as members of the Defence Forces, An Garda Síochána, the Prison Service, ambulance service and fire service are all leaving because there is no pension entitlement at the end of the day. Pension entitlement was one of the things that drove retention in the Defence Forces - you served your 21 years and you were well looked after with a decent pension. That is gone, and we are losing people because of it. I ask the Minister to raise this with the Minister for Finance. Political Ireland has to take control and stop letting the civil servants tell us what to do.

On 29 January, the Government, upon the nomination of the Taoiseach, formally appointed Ministers of State. This is a matter causing some concern in the wider public. There is a Minister of State in the Department of the Taoiseach, the Department of foreign affairs with special responsibility for European affairs and, it states, at the Department of Defence. Will the Minister advise what statutory status the Minister of State has with respect to defence? Anybody I speak to is unsure. The Minister of State makes lots of statements and speeches but what statutory role does the junior Minister have?

All Irish Ministers, senior and junior, make pronouncements, verbal and written, and state simultaneously that Ireland is not politically neutral but militarily neutral. In customary international law, where the rules and obligations of neutrality are codified, there is no such subdivision of neutrality. Either a state is neutral or non-aligned or it is part of an alliance. Where in customary international law is such a subdivision of neutrality, as articulated by Ireland's senior and junior Ministers, specifically codified or cited? It is confusing to hear people talking about political neutrality and military neutrality. There is no such thing. You are either neutral or you are not.

Government Ministers repeatedly talk about the €1.7 billion in the defence budget. Vote 35 deals with pensions and Vote 36 is the normal pay and other running costs of the Defence Forces. Some 73% of Vote 36 is to be expended on pay and allowances, traditionally. The cost of recurring expenditure on maintenance of lands, utilities, fuel, spare parts, is borne by the remaining 27%, along with the cost of attaining and maintaining operational capability, the core business of the Defence Forces. What portion of this paltry 27% of Vote 36 is actually allocated in 2026 for the said operational capability such as the purchase of primary radar, anti-drone equipment, maritime sonar, arms and ammunition, armoured and specialised vehicles and allied and associated drivers?

We are talking about buying primary radar. If we bought it today, it would not be operational until 2028 and we have nobody able to use it. If we see something in our sky, what will we do? Will we send a strongly worded letter on headed paper up to the pilot who is in our airspace and say "Please leave us"? This is outrageous. Similarly with sonar, we do not have people who can use or interpret sonar. How long will it take to train them if and when we buy it? I have concerns about that.

We heard lots of talk in recent times about the multi-role vessel, MRV, the Naval Service was to buy. Where is it? Is buying it still on the cards? I am also deeply concerned about our procurement from one state alone. I will have something to say about that in the near future. It is most peculiar that all procurement in defence is coming from one source only.

Nicole Ryan (Sinn Fein)
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Senator, your time is up. I will have to ask you wrap up.

Gerard Craughwell (Independent)
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It is irresponsible. There is much I would like to say but, unlike my colleagues, I do not have 15 minutes.

Nicole Ryan (Sinn Fein)
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Before I call the next speaker, I welcome guests in the Gallery from the Ballincollig Business Association who are guests of Senator Kelleher. You are most welcome. We all hope you enjoy your day. I call Senator Kyne.

Seán Kyne (Fine Gael)
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I welcome the Minister to the Chamber and congratulate her on her appointment. We have had nearly 50 Ministers for Defence and Deputy McEntee is the first female Minister for Defence. I congratulate her personally and politically on that. I thank my colleagues in Fianna Fáil for tabling this motion. I am sure Senator Craughwell knows that if his group tabled a motion, its members would also have 16 minutes on this or any other topic they wished to pursue.

Senator Wilson spoke about today's world. It is safe to say today's world has gone a bit mad. There were always incidents but, for the first time in a long time, it has become politically unstable in areas close to us in the Continent of Europe. One often hears pub talk and people asking why we need an Army. If anything happened in this country, these people would be the first on social media to say we do not have the capabilities or we should have done more and invested more. We have to take seriously the changed political circumstances across the world.I welcome, first of all, the commissioning of the policy in relation to the renewal of the Defence Forces and now the level of ambition 2 and the movement, we hope, to level of ambition 3 with continued investment over the coming years.

We had an interesting visit to Gormanston Camp, County Meath, a number of months ago as members of the defence and national security committee. It is great to see the level of investment because recruits and trainees deserve the very best of facilities. It is good to see the investment visible on the ground. It will be impressive. It is, I suppose, halfway through or whatever. There is more planned work needed but it is certainly something that will be fitting for our new recruits there.

We heard from officers and we have seen that the numbers are increasing, and that is to be welcomed. According to the official figures, we are below the establishment strength but the numbers of discharges have reduced somewhat since 2022. That is to be welcomed. If you look at the number of recruits serving in 2020 after 24 months, we had 170 in the Army, 36 in the Naval Service and none in the Air Corps, making a total of 206. In 2023, the comparable figures were 244 in the Army, 57 in the Naval Service, ten in the Air Corps and a total of 311. In 2024, after 24 months, the figures were 142 in the Army, 45 in the Naval Service, seven in the Air Corps and a total of 194. We would expect to see those figures increasing with the number of recruits that have come in. Certainly, it is welcome that there is that level of interest. That level of interest does not happen by accident because there have been, following decisions by the Government, increasing budgets for the Department of Defence.

During the downturn, defence was treated like every other Department whereby Ministers' first decision was to cut their budgets. That was the requirement - to cut budgets and to cut expenditure. Over the years we have seen the level of expenditure across all Departments increase, and so too for the Department of Defence. That is certainly very welcome indeed.

Attrition rates and the numbers that have to buy themselves out of the Army was something that has been brought up. That has been somewhat stabilised and we have seen overall staffing levels in the Defence Forces increased. As I said, it is not by accident. There has been progress on pay, as well as the extension of the existing service commitment scheme for Air Corps pilots to air traffic controllers personnel, an increase in the mandatory retirement age to 62, the extension of private healthcare, the provision of fitness training and sports facilities, as we have seen in Gormanston and elsewhere, and progress on the Defence Forces infrastructure development plan with the highest level of financial resources in the State's history. All of that is welcome in leading to a more positive atmosphere for recruits.

We have a long-standing tradition of overseas deployment. From talking to people, both in these Houses and elsewhere, it is a huge honour and something that attracts recruits to the Irish Defence Forces. We have that proud record, notwithstanding the decisions in relation to UNIFIL as well.

I was watching online a former UK Secretary of Defence talk of the hollowing out of defence forces over 20 or 30 years, even in the UK, . It is something that perhaps Europe was never, or certainly since the end of the Cold War was not, investing sufficient in our defence and that level of co-operation which is absolutely needed. We have seen the threats that are going on which very few countries on their own in Europe would be able to withstand without the support of others as well.

We have to be able to stand on our own two feet or be seen to do it. I welcome the level of investment but there is a lot more that needs to be done. The Minister has the ambition and the Government, through the commission on renewal, has the blueprint in relation to that and the budget to go with it.

Pauline Tully (Sinn Fein)
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I welcome today's motion regarding our Defence Forces, which has been proposed by Senators Wilson and Gallagher, my two constituency colleagues, and I recognise the urgent need for investment and reform to improve the quality of life of personnel and the overall strength and readiness of our Defence Forces.

A crisis has been allowed to develop within the Defence Forces due to long-standing neglect by a series of Governments. The State has completely failed to plan for the future and to ensure that Ireland has a defence force that is fit for purpose.

Our Defence Forces are effectively at rock bottom in terms of morale and are seriously struggling to manage recruitment and retention. For a military as comparatively small as ours, it is a shambolic failing that we are not able to ensure that our basic staffing and equipment needs are being met.

We currently have fewer than 8,000 personnel in the Permanent Defence Force, well below the established strength, never mind the 11,000 personnel recommended under stage 2 of the Commission on Future of Defence Forces. We have had the embarrassing situation where ships have been put to sea with no functioning main gun because of a lack of specialist staff to operate it or have been unable to be put to sea at all due to lack of crew.

I welcome the intention of this motion, but we now need to see real and meaningful follow-through from the Government parties. The men and women of the Defence Forces deserve better than what they have seen from the previous Government.

It is worth remembering that when Micheál Martin was Minister for Defence, he repeatedly returned defence money to the Exchequer unspent – €30 million in 2024, €70 million in 2023 and €70 million in 2022. What this results in is the systematic decline of our Defence Forces.

In the past five years, we have had more people leave than join, resulting in a clear drain of our experience and expertise. We have also seen how more than 900 people recruited to the Defence Forces since 2020 left within five years.

Unfortunately, we are now in a situation where the lack of personnel and capabilities in our Defence Forces is a threat to our national security. We have seen it most recently during the visit of President Zelenskyy to Ireland, in which we were left vulnerable to drone attacks. There are also the very real vulnerabilities to our offshore cables and our inability to surveil our own airspace.

The reality is that our Defence Forces are in a very precarious position as a result of Government underfunding and despite a series of promises and commitments, we have seen very little practical change. It is long past time for the Government to cease the neglect of the Defence Forces and ensure that Ireland has a defence force that is fit for purpose.

Sinn Féin believes Ireland must be both strong on defence and equally strong on protecting our neutrality. That means ensuring that we have Defence Forces that are able to ensure the security of the State and that enable us to participate and contribute in UN peacekeeping missions to the best of their abilities.

The focus of this Government should be on rebuilding the Defence Forces, ensuring that it has the personnel and equipment that it needs, while protecting our core value of neutrality. Our neutrality has been our greatest protection since the founding of the State and it is needed more now than ever. We are in a very difficult and volatile period of history, with the possibility of war becoming more real every day. It is vitally important that the Government is clear-sighted in ensuring the readiness of our Defence Forces and does not make rash moves such as scrapping the triple-lock neutrality protection.

The amendment I intend to propose has been put forward by Sinn Féin Senators. The amendment calls for:

the creation of a health outcomes assessment for Air Corps Medical Personnel similar to the Study of Health Outcomes in Aircraft Maintenance Personnel process in Australia, in order to identify potential adverse health outcomes for said personnel, and to ensure that Air Corps Maintenance personnel are supported with healthcare costs for such potential outcomes using an appropriate mechanism;...

To explain, there have been multiple cases of long-term medical conditions that former Air Corps personnel believe to be connected to exposure to hazardous chemicals. The urgent priority now must be ensuring that medical needs of the former personnel are addressed but there is also a need for answers.

What they deserve, most urgently of all, is to have their medical care addressed. We call for an immediate medical assessment of former Air Corps personnel to see whether they are affected by exposure to chemicals. The Government also needs to engage with the personnel in question to ensure that a mechanism is found to ensure the personnel and their families are supported with medical care as they deserve answers.

Nicole Ryan (Sinn Fein)
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Before I call the Minister, I welcome our visitors in the Gallery, the female Ógra from Fianna Fáil who are guests of Senator O'Loughlin. They are most welcome to the Gallery and I hope they enjoy their day.

Helen McEntee (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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I welcome our guests as well. I hope they have an enjoyable day.

I thank the Senators for tabling this motion. I am really pleased to have an opportunity to engage with Senators for the first time in taking on this role.I look forward to working with many colleagues in relation to our Defence Forces in view of the significant change in geopolitical environment in which we find ourselves.

We are discussing this matter at a time of huge volatility and uncertainty regarding our security and the security environment in general that we are operating in, from Ukraine to Gaza and from the continent of Africa to things that are happening much closer to home. Right now, defence and security issues rightly command greater public attention than they did even two or three years ago. As a result, it is right that we are here discussing this matter today. We are not on our own in this regard. Where colleagues make reference to Ireland perhaps being a weak link or a weak chain, particularly in the context of the recent visit of President Zelenskyy, I remind them that the visit went off extremely well. When I sit at the table and talk to other defence colleagues across Europe, I hear from them about issues with drones, instances where they have had to close airspace and where bombs have exploded on railway lines. It is very clear to me that we are all living in this shared challenging environment and we need to make sure we are all focused on the one thing, which is supporting our members of the Defence Forces. I can assure Senators that this is my priority.

I acknowledge the work that has been done to date in respect of the Report of the Commission on the Defence Forces. We need to be ambitious and work together to make sure that we can achieve the overall ambitious targets the report contains. As Minister, my priority is not just overseeing the implementation of the report but also ensuring that we support the men and women of Óglaigh na hÉireann to do what they do best, namely engaging in peacekeeping missions right across the world. The latter is something of which we have been so proud for many decades. My priority is also to support them in their work in protecting our citizens, our national security and our democracy, be that through legislative means, our overall investment by means of capital and current spending or through our partnerships with other countries. It is really important in the world in which we live that we are working and engaging not just with our nearest neighbours but also with our international partners. Given what is happening, that has never been more important. I look forward to working with Senators on all of these issues.

Regarding our legislative programme, the first legislation I intend to have before the Seanad in the coming weeks is the Defence (Amendment) Bill. The latter is aimed at changing the basis of how we deploy our Defence Forces personnel overseas, including changing the triple lock. For me and for many people here and other colleagues, it is simply not acceptable, particularly in light of recent global turmoil, that any one of five permanent members of the UN Security Council have an essential veto on Ireland participating in peacekeeping missions overseas. The Bill will address that. I have engaged on the pre-legislative scrutiny that has taken place with colleagues, and I look forward to working with Senators and engaging with them on the many important proposals they suggested at the committee.

As I have heard already from colleagues, one constant always emerges on any debate on defence and that is the deep respect, admiration and pride we all feel for the women and men of Óglaigh na hÉireann. They are, without question, the Defence Forces' greatest strength. The Government is committed to ensuring that the Defence Forces have the equipment, resources and capabilities required to fulfil the roles assigned to them. I, too, acknowledge the Members of this House and the Dáil who have served and who are serving members. At the heart of the Government's commitment is a clear focus on people. Our personnel are our greatest asset, and supporting them in their careers, their well-being and their development remains my central priority.

The motion before the House rightly acknowledges the substantial progress made in recent years. Meaningful improvements have been delivered in pay, medical care, retirement and in recruitment age and working conditions, including the commencement and the application of the working time directive across the Defence Forces in January 2025. There is real and tangible progress under way. Again, last year saw an increase of almost 200 personnel in strength. While I appreciate that is not the number we want to get to and is a modest step, it is to be welcomed nonetheless. It reflects a positive trajectory which we need to continue. The motion before the House also recognises the enormous strides that have been made in recent years, whether that is, as I have said, in relation to progress on pay, the extension of private medical care to all ranks, and the maximum retirement age and the recruitment age, or the commencement of the working time directive. That said, it should be acknowledged in the context of almost full employment in our economy, that these are challenges that are not just unique to the Defence Forces. They are challenges being faced by all armed forces right across Europe.

What is becoming increasingly clear is that the reforms that are being introduced and have taken time are making that difference, although I appreciate there is more to do. Last year, 16,510 applications from people seeking to join the Defence Forces were received. The next step is making sure we take progress those applications. The strategic workforce plan on which I am working with my Department and the Defence Forces will set out a very clear and evidence-based pathway to achieving that overall strength of 11,500 personnel aligned with our future capability needs. Just this week, I met with members of the Defence Forces and staff of my Department to discuss the work they are doing to set out the strategic workforce plan that needs to include members of the Defence Forces and an increased focus on civilianisation, an area in which there is so much work that can be done.

We will also make sure to continue to increase the number of Reserve members. I met with their representative association yesterday, and huge strides are in progress. To use the association's words, there is huge "untapped potential" that we can work with and that can support the overall work of our Defence Forces. Sustaining the progress made in 2025 is a priority and is essential, which is why the Defence Forces are targeting the recruitment of more than 850 personnel this year. It was just under 800 last year. We are increasing our target and will do everything do try to exceed that as well.

As today's motion recalls most of the positive measures introduced in recent years, I will not dwell on them. However, I would like to say a few words about some of the progress made on pay. Pay and conditions, while they are not everything - and from speaking to members, I understand that absolutely - they are an important part of ensuring the Defence Forces can recruit and retain the people they need. Good progress has been made in this area. While progress made in this regard stands to be further enhanced with the additional pay awards due later on in February under the terms of the current public sector pay agreement. I know there is much more we need to do and that is something we need to work across government in progressing.

As Senators will be aware, we recently launched the Defence Sectoral National Development Plan 2026-2030, which sets out a very clear and ambitious vision for the future of our Defence Forces, again aligning with the overall objectives of the Commission on the Defence Forces. I am absolutely committed to ensuring that there is continuing ongoing transformation of our Defence Forces. Capital funding of €1.7 billion has been allocated. This is an increase of €600 million, or a 55% increase, on the previous baseline figure of €1.1 billion. This is about modernising and transforming the capabilities of the Defence Forces across a number of different domains, and ensuring Ireland continues to meet its national and international security responsibilities.

I am particularly conscious of the fact that our EU Presidency will start later this year and of the need to ensure that everything that can be done is done as soon as possible to make sure we have the right structures and the infrastructure in place. Key elements include record multi-annual investment, rising from €300 million in 2026 to €360 million in 2029, with major capability upgrades across land, air, maritime and cyber domains. This will include full delivery of the military radar programme by 2028. This is something that I have asked be moved forward to make sure we have that capability in place and that we start that process this year in the context of our Presidency. This is an essential step in the Government's plan to enhance our national security and the need to continuously strengthen our defence capabilities.

The defence sectoral plan also provides for Air Corps modernisation and other key equipment investments, including procurement of subsea domain awareness capability for the Defence Forces. I recognise that training will be required in this regard. This is a key priority in order to ensure that when we have the requisite equipment in place, we will also have personnel capable of using it.

I am pleased to report that there has been a significant investment in defence infrastructure. At the end of 2025, over €270 million worth of capital projects were at various different stages of the procurement pipeline, from design, planning and construction to substantial completion. Notable projects for this year include: the military medical facility in Baldonnel, at a cost of €16.2 million; the block 1 accommodation complex in Collins Barracks, Cork, at a cost of €4.9 million; and the new dining hall in Aiken Barracks, Dundalk, at a cost of €5.5 million. The total allocation for infrastructure capital works this year stands at just under €70 million, with €13.5 million set aside for the Defence Forces in respect of the maintenance of existing infrastructure.

I recently visited Gormanston in my constituency to see how the various buildings are progressing. We need to ensure that we invest in the infrastructure in which the men and women are staying, sleeping, eating and going to the gym, because that is a sign that we recognise and fully support the work they do. In addition, a significant portion of funding through the NDP will be used to invest in new uniforms for the men and women of Óglaigh na hÉireann and in the new equipment they require.

In the context of our capital budget, this year a record allocation of €1.49 billion for the defence sector is being provided. Again, this is an increase of €145 million on 2025.As Minister, I will do everything I can to continue to increase the current budget.

Turning to a number of points made specifically in the motion, I assure the House that I am committed to ensuring a fully functioning conciliation and arbitration system for the Defence Forces; one that operates effectively, transparently and with the confidence of all parties involved. The conciliation and arbitration, C and A, scheme for members of the PDF provides a formal mechanism for the military representative associations, RACO and PDFORRA. I will meet officials from both organisations tomorrow to engage on matters that come within the scope of the overall scheme. In the event of disagreements, one or other of the parties can seek adjudication or arbitration on the matter. It is important that we have this in place. I appreciate that we currently do not have the adjudicator in place for the Defences Forces and for the scheme, but I know there is a lot of work happening on both sides to make sure that it is in place as soon as possible. In relation to the arbitration board, I am pleased to say that yesterday the Government approved the appointment and reappointment of members to the arbitration board. The new term will run until 7 November 2026.

I will briefly touch on issues relating to pensions, including those affecting single scheme entrants since 2013. This is something that continues to be raised by the representative bodies, but, as all Members know, this is an issue that arises from public service-wide legislation and is something that will be discussed with other Departments and other sectors as well. I am conscious of this issue and that it is a concern. It is certainly something I will engage with the unions on.

In recognition of the need to retain experienced and skilled personnel and to enable personnel to extend their careers in the Defence Forces, the mandatory retirement age for members was extended to 62 years of age with effect from 19 August 2024. This was at the same time the mandatory retirement age for members of An Garda Síochána was also extended. That was something I worked closely on at the time. The move very much aims to address in part the provision of extended career opportunities for members, if they so wish. From my understanding of the figures and looking at them to date, we are starting to see that having a positive impact, but we hope to see greater impact in the time ahead.

A number of matters set out in the motion are currently being considered through the C and A process, which remains the most appropriate and effective in terms of their overall resolution.

I will very briefly comment on our chaplains as it is a matter that has come up and been raised with me a number of times. It is also something I will speak to the unions about. My officials are examining the status of the chaplains going forward and the potential legislative underpinning needed to provide for changes to status. This is something I am working with my officials on and will speak to the representative associations about tomorrow. I think it is accepted that the proposals will necessitate amendments to primary legislation and, if that is the case, I am happy to bring that forward as well.

Another issue that has come to the fore in recent years is the overall environment for members of the Defence Forces - not just female members, but all members. I was pleased to last week publish the first Value Our People survey. This was undertaken over the past year by the Defence Forces. Over 60% of members engaged in the process which is the highest feedback they have received. This touched on quite a number of different issues. It was not just pay. It looked at the conditions in which members work, the equipment they have, as well as looking at the overall work environment. It touched on some really difficult issues around sexual harassment and other issues that have really come to the fore in recent years. I am pleased to have engaged with not just the Defence Forces but also the body that has been put in place and is chaired by Patricia King. It has done a huge amount of work both before and since the survey was undertaken. It continues to respond to the many concerns raised, not just around sexual harassment or issues that came to the fore through the Women of Honour group, but also the many other issues raised at all levels through the Naval Service, Air Corps and the Permanent Defence Force. It is important we keep that focus and continue working with the Defence Forces on these issues to bring about the types of organisational changes that perhaps had not come to the fore in recent times.

At the outset, I mentioned one of the very significant changes that have been made, which is the introduction of the Organisation of Working Time Act in January 2025. This work, which is known as strand 3, is under way. I appreciate it is a complex piece of work that impacts across a range of areas, but I look forward to it being brought to a conclusion very soon.

There is so much that we could discuss and so much happening, but, for me, it is very much about us being on the same page. I want to work with the Members to ensure our Defence Forces, the men and women who literally keep us and so many others safe, as they have done for many years right across the globe, have the support they need and know they have our support and that, as the only Defence Forces, in this country their members have the equipment, technology, infrastructure and capabilities they need to be able to do their jobs as effectively as possible in the extremely challenging and worrying environment we are living in at the moment. I look forward to working with colleagues on this issue in the time ahead.

Nicole Ryan (Sinn Fein)
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The next speaker is Senator Stephenson from the Cross-Party Group. Does the Senator wish to share time?

Patricia Stephenson (Social Democrats)
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Yes, with my colleagues Senators Harmon and Higgins.

Nicole Ryan (Sinn Fein)
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Is that agreed? Agreed.

Patricia Stephenson (Social Democrats)
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I welcome the Minister, Deputy McEntee, in her new role. It is historic to have a woman in this position for the first time and I congratulate her on that. I welcome this motion and that successive Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael Governments have finally seen fit to fix their absolute bungling of Defence Forces funding, recruitment and retention of personnel and infrastructure. They have stood over the atrophy of the Irish Defence Forces for the past 20 years, to the point that the ability of our Defence Forces to man ships, monitor our skies and do their jobs safely has been placed under serious threat.

The stance of the Social Democrats has been clear: we need urgent investment in the Defence Forces. We need ships in the water, we need recruits being trained and we need to put an end to the decades of underinvestment by Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil that has left the people who risk everything for this country on the breadline with their families. We are faced with a recruitment crisis at a time when we need our Defence Forces to provide national-level defence and to support humanitarian missions.

We had the longest unbroken peacekeeping record in the world, yet we pulled out of the Golan Heights - not due to a lack of a UN mandate or because of neutrality, but because we simply did not have the numbers and we chose to prioritise an EU battle group instead. That humanitarian peacekeeping is the beating heart of our Defence Forces. It is what we do best and it drives recruitment. When the Irish Naval Service engaged in humanitarian missions in the Mediterranean and was saving lives daily, applications to the Defence Forces increased. When we decided to pivot away from search and rescue, many decided their time in our Naval Service was done.

Issues around pay and conditions, the gutting of the Defence Forces pension and cultural issues meant that good women and men chose not to stick around past their obligatory period of duty. This trend, which was caused by problems we have seen fester over decades, means we all lose out as a nation. The pay and conditions afforded to members up to this point show a complete underappreciation of the role the Defence Forces played for Ireland, both internationally and at home.

I particularly welcome Senator Clonan's amendment calling for an end to the sexual violence and bullying that has persisted in the Defence Forces. Sexual violence must be stamped out in all spaces and women and men who choose to serve must have dignity and safety within the workplace.

Across Ireland, people rightly take pride in the Defence Forces. We are proud of the international reputation we have as peacekeepers, with men and women in the Defence Forces acting with honour, bravery and integrity to protect others. However, the simple fact is that the underinvestment and underfunding of the Defence Forces which we have seen for decades has left them on their knees. It really should not be like this any more. That is why I welcome the Fianna Fáil Senators bringing this motion forward.

Laura Harmon (Labour)
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It is important and timely that we are having this debate here today. It is imperative that we invest in our Defence Forces and particularly in our defence personnel. This a matter of national security. The Labour Party has supported reaching level of ambition 2 for the Defence Forces.

We need to know what is happening in our territorial waters. We need to know what is happening in our airspace, particularly in the current geopolitical environment. This includes drones and undersea cables. However, we can invest in all the equipment that we want, but if we are not looking after the personnel in our Defence Forces then we will not have people to operate that equipment.

I am going to talk about the navy for a little bit. Cork plays a key role in our security, particularly with our upcoming Presidency of the EU this year. The navy's numbers have increased in the past year but they are still far short of the strength required to patrol Ireland's waters. Figures from October 2025 indicate that the Naval Service had 784 personnel out of a required strength of 1,094. We are back at 2022 levels in terms of strength. We need to increase naval patrol duty allowance further. The Naval Service tax credit, which was increased in 2021, has not kept pace with inflation.

Investment in living quarters for our Defence Forces personnel at barracks and naval bases is crucial. We need to invest more in housing and childcare facilities for members of our Defence Forces based in Collins Barracks and Haulbowline Naval Base in Cork. Ensuring a work-life balance is essential for recruitment and retention of the women and men in our Defence Forces.The lack of powers of the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Defence and National Security is also notable. "National Security" was added to the title of that committee. At times, this seems tokenistic to me, if I may say so. The Government added this title but added very few new powers. The Garda special detective unit and the Department of the Taoiseach have declined invitations in the past to address the committee and provide national security updates. Our party leader, Deputy Ivana Bacik, has long called for briefings for Opposition leaders on national security, as provided in many other countries. Where is our long-term strategy for national security? The National Security Analysis Centre was established in 2019 and taoisigh and Ministers for Defence have been promising a comprehensive national security strategy for the last five years now.

Investment in our Defence Forces is essential. We are under-investing at the minute. We need to look after the women and men who are working in our Defence Forces. I express my thanks and appreciation for the work they do. Ultimately, pay and conditions, recruitment and retention, and work-life balance are essential. Dignity, respect and a zero-tolerance policy on sexual violence and bullying in the Defence Forces need to be upheld.

Alice-Mary Higgins (Independent)
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It is good, now that this issue has been raised for years, that some progress is beginning to be made on pay and conditions for our Defence Forces. The motion addresses the specifics of pay and conditions. I welcome that it also raises the crucial question of representation, calls for Defence Force chaplains to be allowed to have membership of representative associations and calls for proper measures around the working time directive and on making decent employment available and accessible to members of the Defence Forces. Those are positive components of the motion, which I support.

I very much echo the support expressed by previous speakers for the amendment on bullying and sexual harassment. We know these have been issues within the Defence Forces and they need to be seriously addressed. I commend Senator Tom Clonan in particular on his work on the amendment.

Speaking about the pay, conditions and support for our Defence Forces is crucial but it needs to be teased out from the massive shift we are seeing on a wider level towards huge expenditure on military and defence. This expenditure is largely not going to the Defence Forces and pay and conditions. It is going to some of the industries that are profiting extraordinarily from a climate in which military expenditure is being ramped up.

The finance committee did a report, which was published in December, examining the €800 billion being pushed as EU expenditure. Much of that money is being routed away from social cohesion funding, which we know in Ireland is what builds peace between communities. I have just come from a meeting of the environment committee where we heard about the proposal to move LIFE funding, which funds projects on the ground in Mayo, Clare, Roscommon and across the country, and in the Natura communities. These projects are exactly what we are always calling for in the environmental area. They actually pay landowners and local communities for doing work on biodiversity and climate. That funding could potentially be rerouted into security and defence as well. These are the things that are part of the peaceful world we all want to work for. They are part of our collective security and environmental security.

The motion focuses on the right areas, which need support. While I agree that we need ships, it is in a context of a defence spending narrative which is risking our collective security and integrity within the European Union.

I am signalling the report from the joint committee on finance because it is very relevant. We specifically called for fair and equitable pay and conditions and increased resourcing for recruitment, retention and the well-being of members of the Defence Forces. We also highlighted the dangers arising from a €150 billion loan programme that Ireland has been asked to underwrite. We have the resources and there is nothing that has stopped the State from delivering pay and conditions for many years. We are not dependent on Europe in that regard but we are contributing potentially to a €150 billion loan programme, which will give €16 billion to Hungary, a state teetering on the brink of authoritarianism. It was directly confirmed by the Commission, when its officials met the committee, that this money will be given over to the manufacture and purchase of cluster munitions and landmines.

Let us have the discussions and support our Defence Forces through the kinds of measures sought in the motion. We can do that, while also having a critical voice on areas of defence spending that are risking our collective security and our future when we look to the impact military expenditure can have on our environment. There are also moral issues such as the use of cluster bombs. I am hoping we can get that balance. I say this too because that is also a small part of the recruitment and retention issues. I say this having spoken to people who have been in the Naval Service. People have spoken. We all remember the powerful testimonies of those on the naval ships who saved lives in the Mediterranean Sea. At one point, Ireland was saving 8,000 lives a year in the Mediterranean, but we moved on from that. I remember the moment. The then Minister of State, Paul Kehoe, said that we were moving from a primarily humanitarian function to a primarily security function with Operation Sophia, and then we stopped saving lives. The number of lives saved went down to 2,000 before Operation Sophia abandoned search and rescue altogether. I know naval officers who left the service. I know members of the Army who put up with disgraceful pay and conditions because they are proud, knowing that they are in an Army that serves a neutral country, that is always about principles and serving humanity rather than interests, that works under the UN and that has a record they can be very proud of. That is also something we need to address so that people can continue to be confident in what the future will be for them if they join the Irish armed forces. That is a linking piece, along with pay and conditions, which I hope we can also address.

Fiona O'Loughlin (Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Dooley, for being here for a very important motion from the Fianna Fáil grouping. We have seen significant progress in recruitment and retention over the last number of years. Year on year, for the past three years, we have seen recruitment increase, which is important. It is also important to acknowledge the ongoing innovation by senior military management and the Department of Defence in relation to structures and methodology on recruitment and retention. It is a job worth doing. Our gratitude, thanks and respect must go to the men and women who serve in the Defence Forces at home and abroad. We are increasingly proud of them.

Senators across the Chamber want to see the Government investing in the people in our Defence Forces and in our infrastructure, equipment and command and control structures to create Defence Forces that are ready to face the challenges we face in the strange geopolitical world we are in at the moment. We would be wrong not to note that there are challenges. There are well documented challenges right across the service. It has to be a priority to address those and show the men and women serving in Óglaigh na hÉireann that we respect them and want to make sure they have proper pay and conditions. In a competitive labour market with full employment, there are always going to be challenges. We are bound to see people leaving different types of employment in order to take up other opportunities. The reason my colleagues and I brought this motion forward was to highlight some areas the Minister and the Government could focus on to help meet those challenges. Up to November last, a total of 15,781 applications were received. This shows that there is interest in joining the Defence Forces. The challenge is to convert those applications into inductions. In that context, the Minister has spoken about the workforce plan, which we await with anticipation. We certainly hope it is going to help.

As for the specifics of the motion, we are looking for an evaluation of the Public Service Pensions (Single Scheme and Other Provisions) Act 2012 in the context of its impact on retention of personnel in the Defence Forces. Of course, this matter does not just relate to the Defence Forces because gardaí and firefighters have spoken about it as well. It is important to state that we consulted RACO and PDFORRA on all the recommendations we have included in the motion.

The second recommendation in the motion is that the disparity in pension entitlements for personnel who enlisted after 1994 and before 2024 has to be addressed. There is a particular adverse circumstance for personnel who enlisted during that period in that they do not receive the entitlement to 13 weeks’ of pre-retirement leave or the 78 weeks’ worth of gratuity awarded to personnel on newer pension schemes. This has to be addressed.

The third recommendation concerns the appointment of an adjudicator to the conciliation and arbitration scheme for the Permanent Defence Force. The Minister referenced that, and it is important. It is time to act on this matter. There is a recommendation in this regard. The position of adjudicator has been vacant four times in the past six years.

The fourth recommendation relates to the Defence Forces chaplain. We all remember the heinous attack on Fr. Paul Murphy, which underscored the vulnerability of those who are serving in this role. We and the representative organisations want to see this addressed, as it needs to be.

The fifth recommendation is on the commencement of adjustments to pay and allowances as agreed under the local bargaining arrangements of the Public Service Agreement 2024-2026. This is simply overdue, and we owe it to the Defence Forces to get on with it.

The sixth recommendation relates to the establishment of a specialist pay review body outside local bargaining provisions to consider the appropriateness of current rates of technical pay for specialists. The Commission on the Defence Forces recommended the introduction of a mechanism in this regard. It is really important, and I urge the Minister to ensure that this happens.

Improvements in initial cadet pay is our seventh recommendation. It remains the lowest in the Defence Forces at just €493 per week compared with €540 for a recruit and €617 for a two-star trainee. We also call for a review of the current duty pay system. From our engagement with PDFORRA in particular, we know this is a key issue. We need to have that and the implementation of the third strand of the working time directive dealt with. I add to that the need for an examination of the introduction of long service increments and the rank of lance corporal.

I will use the remaining 30 seconds to address two issues pertaining to Kildare. As Senators know, Kildare is the home and the heart of the Defence Forces. There is a small issue there which would mean an awful lot if it was addressed, namely the opening of the Curragh swimming pool to current and former personnel and their families and to local schools. When Micheál Martin was Minister for Defence, it was agreed that if an investment of €250,000 was made in respect of the swimming pool, it would be reopened to these groups. Two and a half years later, this has not happened. We need it to happen, and we also need action in respect of the Curragh plains. The Department of Defence is currently responsible for managing the plains, but an agreement has been made to the effect that this responsibility should move elsewhere. We need action in respect of that matter.

Joe O'Reilly (Fine Gael)
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I welcome the Minister of State with responsibility for the marine, Deputy Dooley. It is good to have him here for this important debate. It was also good to have the Minister, Deputy McEntee, here earlier. She is clearly very hands on and proactive in her approach. Her visibility as Minister for Defence should prove an incentive to young women and women in general to join the Defence Forces. That would be a major development. It could, among other things, be a good byproduct of her Ministry.

I support the motion, which was very competently proposed by Senators Wilson and Gallagher on behalf of the Fianna Fáil group. I agree with the broad thrust of it.

I will be alluding more to this later, but I take this opportunity congratulate a very good friend of mine Commandant Mark Kiernan of the Reserve Defence Force. He is officer in command of C Company, 27th Infantry Division. It is a huge personal achievement for him and a recognition of his leadership skills, etc., but it is also important for the Reserve in our region and the region Senator Wilson and I, and, of course, Senator Tully, serve. As a consequence of Commandant Kiernan's leadership, there will be even more recruitment in that district to the Reserve Defence Force.

In the context of the motion, recruitment is currently positive due to an increase in pay and allowances, as well as improvements in respect of medical insurance. That is to be welcomed. As the motion states, part of the reason for that is pay for recruits on completion of training being €41,880 in year one. There has been a 51% recruitment increase since 2019. The pay of cadets on commissioning is now €45,795. The pay and conditions are a very important element in the more favourable recruitment. The general status of and respect for our armed forces is a factor too. They should be respected as they have served us well through the years at home and abroad. Respect for the Defence Forces and their position in the public consciousness is improving, which is also important. I am happy that these developments have happened.

The motion sees a need for further development. We need to give extra pay and improved conditions to non-commissioned officers and senior non-commissioned officers to achieve retention. A method of doing that could be a signing-on bonus or long service increments, which I understand is a subject of discussion at the moment. I have the privilege, with others in the House - notably Senator Craughwell - of representing the Defence Forces in the Seanad by being their nominee and from talking to them I understand there is tentative progress in this area, but we need to see it happen in a big way. We need to continue to improve pay and conditions. As was alluded by previous speakers, living conditions are important.The motion establishes that we need to evaluate the Public Service Pensions (Single Scheme and Other Provisions) Act 2012 with regard to impact on retention of the Defence Forces. There is a disparity in pension entitlements for personnel who enlisted post 1994 and pre-2024. That disparity needs addressing and I hope that can be the case.

We need to get the commencement of adjustments to pay and allowances as agreed under the local bargaining arrangement of the Public Service Agreement 2024-2026. We need that enacted and happening. This will all continue to enhance the continued recruitment opportunities.

As I said at the outset, the current recruitment is positive and is due to increases in pay and allowances conditions and medical cover but we need to give extra pay to NCOs and senior NCOs for retention purposes. This could be done by bonuses and long increments. That will happen. We also need to look closer at medical derogations to help keep members and to apply a bit more common sense in that area.

Before I leave, and I did mention the success of our neighbour and friend, Commandant Kiernan, within the Reserve Defence Force but, in conclusion, the Government needs to focus more on the Reserve Defence Force and to invest more in it. Recruitment is improving but more needs to be done there. It is so important for civic spirit and a pathway into the Permanent Defence Force for its members should be more readily available.

It is a great motion and an important discussion, one that we need to keep going. Tragically, it becomes all the more important in the geopolitical context.

Tom Clonan (Independent)
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I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Dooley, for coming along today and I thank Senators Wilson and Gallagher for bringing forward this Private Members' motion. It gives us an opportunity to talk about defence and security at a time of near unprecedented flux and turbulence in the geopolitical security environment. That is one lens through which we need to look at our security and defence but another, probably more important one - if you can imagine that at this time - is what is on the political horizon, which is an all-island entity of some form.

At present, we have six counties in NATO. I do not know if they will remain in NATO but whether they do or not, the future of our Defence Forces has to be interoperable and up to the same standard as NATO. If we are going to get acceptance from all communities on this island for the future of our Defence Forces, the expectations of security guarantees will be very high. They will at least be at the level NATO provides them at present.

I said to the Minister, Deputy McEntee, before she came in here that, as we speak, President Trump is going to make a speech at Davos. I do not know what impact that will have on the transatlantic relationship in the context of Greenland, but I do know it is part of the Gerasimov Doctrine and an aim of the Kremlin to dismantle the current security architecture in Europe and to drive a wedge between Europe and the United States to break that transatlantic relationship. You could almost say the report of the Commission on the Defence Forces on their future, which did great work, already is out of date. I agree with the calls of our colleagues across the floor to move to level of ambition 3, the most ambitious level, as soon as we possibly can.

I put in two amendments to the Private Members' motion, one of which relates to calling for an end to the systemic sexual violence, bullying, harassment and reprisal within the Defence Forces. This has been established without a shadow of a doubt and it is a phenomenon you find in the military internationally. What makes us different from the international military and from other areas of Irish society where you have bullying and sexual harassment, is our Defence Forces have been very slow to acknowledge the fact. Now that they have, I welcome that and they are moving on.

However, I brought this to the fore as a serving officer in 1996 to 2000, when I did my doctoral research, which revealed this endemic and systemic sexual violence and reprisal within the Defence Forces. I became a target of that reprisal myself. The study review group was an independent Government inquiry set up in 2002 at my behest, by the then Fianna Fáil Minister, Michael Smith, and that study, which was very comprehensive, also vindicated my findings. It found that not only were female personnel subjected to systemic bullying and sexual assault up to and including rape, but also young male personnel, particularly in the overseas environment, were also subjected to grooming, sexual assault and rape. There was a wave of suicide among young male troops associated with that.

This led to the setting up of the Ombudsman for the Defence Forces and the independent monitoring group, which continued its work until 2012. Then, in 2021, the Women of Honour came forward with fresh disclosures of sexual violence. This was reinforced by the findings of a judge-led independent review group, IRG, which sat for a year over 2022 and 2023 and found the Defence Forces in 2023 to be a workplace environment that barely tolerated women. That, in turn, has led to a full sworn judge-led inquiry in Smithfield, which is seeking to address the questions I brought up 25 years ago.

If we are going to attract young men and women into the Defence Forces, culture is central to that. We inherited the cultural infrastructure left behind by the British in 1922 and for some reason in the 1920s, they adopted the cultural infrastructure of the British army of the 1920s. That has to go. I am alarmed to see it is reported the Department of Defence has paid a British army colonel to advise and give talks about workplace culture in the Irish Defence Forces. In the international literature, the peer-reviewed military literature, the British army is considered to be the most socially conservative in NATO. We should not be getting advice there. We should be getting advice from perhaps the Bundeswehr, where they have this speak-up culture of "innere führung". That is where we should be going for advice.

Finally, the situation has changed dramatically. We need to radically expand - I have submitted it as an amendment to the Private Members' motion - the Reserve Defence Force. We need to expand that because the demands of this ever-shifting hybrid grey zone conflict that confronts us, and we are going to be caught up in it, is the digital, cyber, artificial intelligence-enhanced defence measures, electronic counter-countermeasures and all that stuff. We have a population that is exceptionally skilled in those areas. We also have a population who would be more than willing and delighted to have the opportunity to give voluntary services to the State in this regard but they cannot currently because the Reserve Defence Force has been so diminished.

We are a country with a population similar to Finland, which has a reserve defence force of 870,000 men and women. We could definitely expand that in a very cost-effective way to prepare us for all the climate change-related, natural and man-made challenges that are going to confront the State, everything from Storm Éowyn to drones over Dublin Bay. Let us mobilise the people.

I welcome the Private Members' motion. I apologise, I have to go to a meeting with the disability committee with our new Minister of State, Deputy Higgins. I do not know if my amendments will be accepted but I thank the Members for the opportunity to discuss them. I hope the Minister of State will pass on some of those concerns and observations to the Minister.

Timmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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I am happy to do so.

Tom Clonan (Independent)
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Thank you.

Alison Comyn (Fianna Fail)
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Does the Senator wish to speak in general?

Michael McDowell (Independent)
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I endorse what has been said just now and what was said earlier by my colleagues in the Independent Group. I do not want to recriminate, but I want to say this. Over the past 20 years, there has been an absolutely scandalous reduction in the capacity of the Irish Defence Forces. It has been supervised by a Department - I want those in the Department to hear this - that displays an unbelievable insouciance. When I was Tánaiste and Minister for justice, there was a Minister for Defence at the Cabinet table. That is no longer the case. As Senator Craughwell pointed out, it is not very clear as to who is concerned full-time about the Defence Forces and their issues.

In the 1960s and 1970s, there was a force called the FCA. It was by no means perfect, but it was not Dad's Army. It guarded installations like the Kippure RTÉ transmitter, sewage plants, ESB plants, Dublin Airport, various reservoirs and the like when there was a threat. It carried out that function at weekends in order to provide time-off for small garrisons from the regular Army that protected those locations on a daily basis. We no longer have a cohort of 15,000 to 20,000 people who could come to the aid of the Government if they were asked to do so. Other than members of the Defence Forces and those involved in gangland activity, who can handle weapons ? Who can take orders? Who can conduct searches, as happened when people were kidnapped and so on? Who could do all these things now? The answer is practically nobody.

As Senator Craughwell stated, we are down to something above 7,000 people in the Permanent Defence Force. That is from a nominal strength of 11,000. The Reserve has almost crumbled completely. I heard what was said earlier about increased recruitment. However, reservists in the FCA had a local place. It was either a training hall in the back of the local Garda station or a barracks in the county town which they could get to within 20 minutes or half an hour on a Sunday to attend training parades. We are now in the very sad position whereby I do not know where reservists from County Mayo, for example, would do their training. Perhaps they would do it in Galway. This means that they would need to devote a couple of hours to get to the training parade and a couple of hours to get back.

The idea of the Reserve Defence Force is much more problematic now than it was then. We have sold off barracks after barracks. Senator Wilson referred to Cavan. There was a military base outside Castleblayney, namely Camp Muckno. I was there myself. There were barracks in Wexford, Waterford and Kilkenny. There is still a barracks in Kilkenny.Right across the country, there were places where a reserve could actually have been organised and trained, but we abandoned that idea completely because we convinced ourselves there was a peace dividend in the wake of the 1998 Belfast Agreement. Things in Northern Ireland could turn quite nasty yet with a Farage government in Britain beating the drum of English nationalism and, perhaps, strident unionism. There is always the possibility that the loyalist paramilitary organisations, which from my reading of northern media are still in existence, could come back with a vengeance. There could be political and community strife in Northern Ireland again, and anybody who says that could never happen is wrong. Nobody predicted what would happen from 1972 to 1998. Everyone thought we were home and dry and that all these things would never happen again.

I believe that we need, in the first instance, a dedicated Minister for Defence. We had Michael Smith and, in the Cabinet I was in, Deputy Willie O'Dea. We had a Department of Defence with a dedicated spokesperson at Cabinet. In those days, the defence budget was taken seriously, but what has happened since has been nothing short of shocking. The membership of the Civil Defence organisation is in ribbons. It has lost half of its members.

When I was a Minister, I was challenged by Opposition parties to have 2,000 reservists. I got the number up to 1,100 and it sank back to 200-plus under successive Governments, which included members of the parties in the present Government. The whole idea of service to the State has evaporated.

I agree completely with the suggestion Senator Conway made, namely, that a small group of determined people with a well-worked-out plan could effectively put this country on its knees by landing at Shannon, Knock or elsewhere in a plane one afternoon. If we cannot guarantee against even that, we are close to the situation that exists in Greenland today, where we cannot defend our sovereign territory. The time has come, I suggest, for us to go to level of ambition 3 as a starting point-----

Michael McDowell (Independent)
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-----to properly equip the Defence Forces, to ensure the appropriate effective strength and to reinstate a voluntary Reserve that in times of national emergency could assist the Government in maintaining order in this country.

Diarmuid Wilson (Fianna Fail)
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I welcome my colleague the Minister of State, Deputy Timmy Dooley, to the House, which will be very familiar to him as he started off here. You could call this place the reserve space for Deputy Dooley before he became a permanent Member of the other place.

Gerard Craughwell (Independent)
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He would be a good old vote in the future.

Diarmuid Wilson (Fianna Fail)
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I started off the debate by saying to the Minister, Deputy McEntee, that defence debates in this place are rational, informed and grounded in the realities of today's world and that I had no doubt but that this would be the case again today. I am glad to report that this has been an excellent debate on defence matters. I thank each and every one of my colleagues who contributed to it.

I acknowledge that we benefit here from the expertise of people who have practical experience of membership of the Defence Forces, at different ranks, and in one case membership of two armies. That is very helpful in this discussion. I acknowledge those who have experience of the Defence Forces through service in the Reserve Defence Force, including Senator McDowell. I understand the Senator was a very rigid and stern member of the military police. I found it hard to believe that he would be that stern. He played a vital role in the military police of the Reserve Defence Force, on which I congratulate him.

Without repeating everything said, there has been a welcome for the progress made on pay and conditions, recruitment and retention. There has been universal acknowledgment of the dedication and commitment of the women and men of our Army, Navy and Air Corps at home and abroad.

We make no secret of the fact that there are challenges ahead. These have been addressed in our motion and mentioned by colleagues today. As members of the Government party, it is our intention to see those concerns addressed as quickly as possible. I agree with Senators McDowell and Craughwell and others that we must get to level of ambition 3 immediately. It is vital to the development of our Defence Forces.

I pay tribute to the members of the Reserve Defence Force. Senator Joe O'Reilly mentioned Commandant Kiernan, who was recently promoted. The commandant, whom Senator Tully also knows, is a prominent member of the Defence Forces and plays an active role. Very relevant points have been made on the Reserve Defence Force. It is a vital cog in our defence and should be promoted throughout our communities. As has been pointed out here today, it is not just about appearing in uniform and providing cover for the Permanent Defence Force. There are other roles that Reserve Defence Force members can assume. These are crucial, particularly in cybersecurity. This should be considered and progress should be made on it.

On Senator McDowell's remark on having a Minister for Defence, we have a Minister for Defence, and that is Deputy McEntee. We do not have a Minister for Defence who holds that position alone but we have a Minister for Defence. I wished her well. She is newly appointed, as we know, and I wish her well in what we know, given all the comments made on the worldwide challenges that face us as a small democratic island, is a crucial role.

I pay tribute to the women and men of our Defence Forces and the representative organisations that represent them daily and communicate with each Member of the Oireachtas.

Defence is integral to national resilience, economic security and, increasingly, the protection of our democratic institutions. That is worth bearing in mind. I thank everybody for their contributions this afternoon.

Gerard Craughwell (Independent)
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Thank you, I was sober.

Alison Comyn (Fianna Fail)
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It would be an insult to the members of the Defence Forces and, perhaps, to donkeys as well. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Seanadóir as sin.

Alison Comyn (Fianna Fail)
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In the absence of Senator Tom Clonan, I ask Senator Conway to move amendment No. 2.

Gerard Craughwell (Independent)
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I second the amendment.

Gerard Craughwell (Independent)
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I second the amendment.

Gerard Craughwell (Independent)
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I move amendment No. 4:

After "calls for:", to insert the following paragraph: "- a survey on bullying and harassment in other workplaces such as An Garda Síochána, the Prison Service, the HSE, and the Ambulance Service in order to establish a national picture regarding this issue in order to avoid the Defence Forces being singled out;"

Pauline Tully (Sinn Fein)
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I move amendment No. 5:

After “calls for:”, to insert the following paragraph: “- the creation of a health outcomes assessment for Air Corps Medical Personnel similar to the Study of Health Outcomes in Aircraft Maintenance Personnel process in Australia, in order to identify potential adverse health outcomes for said personnel, and to ensure that Air Corps Maintenance personnel are supported with healthcare costs for such potential outcomes using an appropriate mechanism;”

Gerard Craughwell (Independent)
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I second the amendment.