Lisa Chambers (Fianna Fail)
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I welcome Deputy John Lahart, Mr. Daniel Hyzack and the students from County Cavan. They are most welcome to the Chamber.

The Order of Business is No. 1, motion regarding proposed approval by Seanad Éireann of the proposal for a Council Decision on the position to be taken on behalf of the European Union in the Specialised Committee on Law enforcement and Judicial Cooperation established by the Trade and Cooperation Agreement, regarding the establishment of a standard form for requests for mutual assistance referred to in Article 635(1) of that Agreement, to be taken on conclusion of Order of Business without debate; No. 2, Patient Safety (Notifiable Incidents and Open Disclosure) Bill 2019 – Committee and Remaining Stages, to be taken at 12.45 p.m. and to adjourn at 2.45 p.m. if not previously concluded; No. 132, Private Members' business, motion 10, regarding the independent review of the handling of past complaints of abuse in St. John Ambulance Ireland, to be taken at 3 p.m. with the time allocated to this debate not to exceed two hours; No. 3, statements on housing, to be taken at 5.30 p.m. and to conclude at 7 p.m. if not previously concluded, with the time allocated to the opening remarks of the Minister not to exceed ten minutes, group spokespersons not to exceed eight minutes, all other Senators not to exceed five minutes, time can be shared, and the Minister to be given no less than ten minutes to reply to the debate; and No. 4, statements on Inland Fisheries Ireland, to be taken at 7 p.m. and to conclude at 8 p.m. if not previously concluded, with the opening remarks of the Minister not to exceed six minutes, all Senators not to exceed six minutes, time can be shared, and the Minister to be given no less than six minutes to reply to the debate.

Joe O'Reilly (Fine Gael)
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I thank the Cathaoirleach for welcoming the pupils, teachers and SNAs from St. Anne's National School in Bailieborough. I live beside St. Anne's. It is a wonderful school community and we in Bailieborough are very proud of it and the achievements of St. Anne's in so many areas. It is an excellent school for which the entire community feels ownership and pride. It is wonderful that they are here. It typifies the excellence of the school that it is considered important to visit the Houses of democracy to see how Government works and see how the Seanad and Dáil work. It is a great honour for the school. I thank the Cathaoirleach for welcoming them.

If I may raise another matter, the Leader will be aware that I have consistently raised the issue of gambling. We have made considerable progress. I applaud the work of the Minister of State, Deputy Browne, and the Minister, Deputy McEntee, in that area over the previous months. The Minister of State has brought forward the legislation and arrangements for the regulator. I would like an update on progress. Belgium has recently banned all gambling advertising. That is worthy of looking at. We have also had the recent outrageous case of the major gambling company engaged in wrong practice in regard to addicts in the UK. That merits examination. One of the greatest ills in our society, and the young people here in the Gallery will appreciate and understand this, is the pernicious addiction to gambling. I am not speaking about normal social gambling, the occasional lottery ticket or the bet on Aintree. I am not talking about that kind of gambling but rather, addiction to gambling prejudicing children, homes, marriages, properties, the whole lot. It is a huge addiction and needs a two-pronged intervention. We need a strong gambling regulator and strong legislation. We also need, and I would like the Leader to look at this facet too, to resource the Department of Health in a way that it can support gambling addicts, which is a separate area for people who have already succumbed to addiction. I will leave it with the Leader and look forward to her response. It is one of the most urgent matters and serious human conditions that will be brought before her today.

Jerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I thank Senator O'Reilly. The people of Bailieborough are just as proud of what the Senator does in this House.

Fiona O'Loughlin (Fianna Fail)
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I wish to raise a number of issues. Yesterday I spoke about the Women of Honour report as we heard about it in the media. Today we have a little more information in regard to that report. Once again I thank the Women of Honour and indeed the Men of Honour who have come forward in regard to stark revelations in the report. Once again I note the substantial work that Senator Clonan and Katie Hannon have done on this issue. It is good that the Government has decided to publish the report at this time. It is also important to note the work of the members of the independent review group.

The report illustrates and highlights a range of out-of-date policies and practices that are not fit for purpose in terms of tackling unacceptable behaviour such as bullying, discrimination, harassment and sexual harassment.I congratulate the Tánaiste on ensuring the report will be a catalyst for transformation within the Defence Forces. The establishment of a statutory inquiry and an external oversight body, as well as changing the legislation to ensure that offences within the Defence Forces can be reported to the Garda, are very important. Work on cultural change and restoring confidence must start now. I wish all those who will be involved in a commissioning ceremony at Collins Barracks this afternoon well. All those considering a career in the Defence Forces should know the culture will change - the Government will ensure it does.

I recently raised issues relating to dog wardens and dog controls and the impact of that, particularly on sheep farmers in south Kildare. My colleague, the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, Deputy McConalogue, brought together an interdepartmental working group to look at areas such as enforcement of relevant laws at local level, microchipping, licences, breeding establishments and the sale of dogs. I am pleased the group has come forward with 15 strong recommendations, under which an extra 40 dog wardens will be put in place throughout the country. It is an important matter I have raised previously. I am pleased that the report has been forwarded.

I was shocked to learn that the ESB recorded an operating profit of €847 million last year. I do not know whether other Members had a similar reaction to the news. That level of profit is shocking when one thinks of the bills people are paying. On Monday I spoke to a dad of four. The most recent electricity bill received by that single-income family is €1,100. It is not sustainable. I acknowledge the electricity credits and the discounted VAT rate but enough is not going to the end user. The Government has to do something about this.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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I thank the Tánaiste and Minister for Defence, Deputy Micheál Martin. I do not intend to go into detail on the report on the Defence Forces published yesterday but it is harrowing. I thank the brave Women of Honour, who had to go public and tell their stories, which is never an easy thing to do, especially in a military culture such as that of the Defence Forces. I acknowledge the work of my colleague, Senator Clonan. He was brave and courageous against the odds and experienced great difficulties and many setbacks as a result of being brave and telling his story. I also acknowledge the work of Katie Hannon in this regard.

I thank the Leader for arranging two matters relating to the Order of Business. It is great to see that the report on St. John Ambulance Ireland is up for debate. This is another harrowing story of abuse and crime. We should remember that these matters relate to criminal activities and that is how they should ultimately be dealt with. I also thank the Leader for arranging statements on Inland Fisheries Ireland. We will debate that issue at great length but only an hour has been allocated to the statements. I would like flexibility in that regard. I am not sure if it is possible within the scope of the Minister’s availability but if more Senators do not volunteer to speak on it, there may be the possibility of allowing a little more time to contributors. That allocation could be fluid, perhaps, and considered later in the day. It is clear there are big issues relating to Inland Fisheries Ireland. This evening, I intend to touch on some of the protected disclosures, which are a shocking indictment of the system.

I am delighted the Ceann Comhairle will unveil a statue of John Hume. What better place for it? John Hume believed in the difference that could be made. In the context of unity, I hope that in the not-too-distant future we may see a similar bust of David Trimble. He came from the unionist tradition, while John Hume came from the nationalist tradition, but that is the history of this island. The unity of this island can only come about by us coalescing and working together. With that in mind, I would like to have a review of or further debate on the shared island initiative of the Office of the Taoiseach. We should constantly have that issue back for debate in the House to tease out incrementally how it is progressing.

Lynn Boylan (Sinn Fein)
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The ongoing issue of Ireland’s neutrality seems to be constantly in the news. It is being pushed by various commentators, including the usual suspects in government who seem to always be flagging the issue that we need to somehow change our approach towards something of which the Irish people are very proud, namely, our neutral status. There has been a systematic attempt to constantly eat away at our neutrality. Most recently, we have seen that from both the Taoiseach, Deputy Varadkar, and the Tánaiste, Deputy Micheál Martin, who recently announced he will bring forward proposals in the coming weeks on a consultative forum to address Ireland’s broader foreign and defence policy, which will include our position on neutrality. Many people have consistently raised concerns regarding the watering down of our neutrality and the constant chipping away at it. That was evident through the referendums on the Nice and Lisbon treaties and the insistence of the Government that Ireland join permanent structured co-operation, PESCO, an EU group that includes military training and exercise and the development of military equipment. That chipping away continues, as was evident last July when the then Minister for Defence, Deputy Coveney, welcomed Ireland becoming a full participant on five PESCO projects. Each such step by Fine Gael- and Fianna Fáil-led governments through decades can be seen as watering down our neutrality. We now have this consultative forum but there is no need for it. In numerous referendums, the people have stated clearly that they are proud of our neutrality and do not want it changed. As my colleague, an Teachta Brady, has stated, a referendum is the correct forum for any discussion on Irish neutrality. It is easy to see why such a suggestion would be ignored by the Government, given that two thirds of voters in the most recent poll on the issue indicated they do not want any change in our neutrality, with less than one quarter in favour of such change. It is clear there is no appetite for moving on the position of Ireland’s neutrality. As I stated, it is a position of which we have been very proud. It has given us a unique advantage on the world stage as we are seen as honest brokers when we go into negotiations. Why would we want to give up that unique position on the world stage just to pander to those who like to constantly do the sabre-rattling at EU level? I hope the public will see through the consultative forum. Instead of the forum, the Government should be giving us a referendum on neutrality.

Jerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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Prior to calling Senator Higgins, I welcome to the Public Gallery Aisling Doyle from County Wicklow, who is in the House with Councillor Avril Cronin. Aisling is here as a transition year student. She is a niece of our former colleague and friend, Andrew Doyle. I thank her for being here.

Alice-Mary Higgins (Independent)
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I propose an amendment to the Order of Business: "That No. 21 be taken before No. 1." The Civil Engagement Group is proposing the introduction of the Electoral Reform (Amendment) and Miscellaneous Provisions Bill 2023 to address some of the gaps in the mandate that was given to the Electoral Commission. When the 2022 Act was progressing through the House, I and colleagues raised deep concerns regarding the glaring absence of Seanad reform from the mandates and tasks being allocated to this new and very welcome commission. Promises of reform were made in the previous Oireachtas. On the first day of that Oireachtas, we brought forward a Bill on Seanad reform. We were asked to put it aside and to sit on a cross-party group to put forward collective cross-party legislation. Along with Senator McDowell and others, I introduced the legislation that came out of that cross-party group in 2020 in order to ensure that every citizen would have a vote in electing the Members of this House. That Bill has been delayed. We were told the Government would address it with the Electoral Reform Act but when that Act came and the Electoral Commission established, the Seanad and Seanad reform were ostentatiously missing. This Bill seeks to address some of the gaps in the functions of the Electoral Commission to ensure it can undertake a review of the electoral system and, crucially, the franchise of the Seanad. The public votes in 1979 and 2013 have been ignored by the Government for too long. The Electoral Commission must be empowered and supported to consider this Chamber of the Oireachtas, which deals with half the legislative process. The Bill would also address two crucial issues that have been raised by our group in the past. The first is the legislation and proposals put forward by my colleague, Senator Ruane, in respect of a clear definition of the meaning of "political purposes" within the Electoral Act.This is an issue which the Standards in Public Office Commission has itself identified as needing to be addressed. The Government again promised to do this in the Electoral Reform Act but failed to do so. This will also look to some of the issues around the age of voting and franchise. I am looking forward to engaging constructively with Members across the House and with the Government on these proposals.

I will finish by echoing some of the points made by Senator Boylan previously which are that Ireland's neutrality has been very misframed, sadly, by the leadership of this Government as somehow being an opting out, stepping back or a passive position, when in fact neutrality is an active role. Neutrality has allowed us to be champions on international law and has allowed us to be credible actors on disarmament. Being neutral is not not caring, as it has been framed. We hear the phrase that we are not neutral on this and international law is talked about. Or, we had the very worrying statement from the Taoiseach that we are not neutral but that we have always been on side of the West. What is very clear is that neutrality is about being on the side of humanity, in favour of international law and international justice for all. That is what has given us our strength and it is very regrettable to see it misrepresented by the leadership of this Government.

Ollie Crowe (Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Cathaoirleach. This morning I raise the issue in this House on the sentences being handed down by our courts. In the past week we have had two shocking examples. In the first case a man, who took part in a savage attack on a young woman which resulted in her being blinded in one eye, was given a four and a half year sentence. I realise the disappointment which was felt across the country in respect of that sentence.

Jerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I must remind the Senator, with the greatest of respect, that as Members of this House we should not comment on the judgments of the Judiciary or on individual cases, given the separation of powers. One can comment on sentencing policy, in general, but not on specific cases. Bí cúramach, le do thoil.

Ollie Crowe (Fianna Fail)
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The main point I am making is that the sentences need to be at a certain level and that has not been happening in cases over the past number of months and years. It is important, as Members of the Seanad Éireann and of the Oireachtas, that we send out the right message that overall, the decisions that are being highlighted are having a significant impact across society. I certainly feel that this is something upon which we should bring the Minister for Justice to the House, in order to have an open discussion on how to improve and go forward in respect of the leniency of the cases. I will leave that subject for now and I thank the Cathaoirleach.

Jerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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My apologies for interrupting the Senator but I also must protect him.

I also welcome the second part of the St. Anne’s National School group from Bailieborough. They missed our colleague and friend, Senator Joe O’Reilly, who spoke eloquently about the school. They are all very welcome to the Chamber.

I call Senator Ward to speak now, please.

Barry Ward (Fine Gael)
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Gabhaim buíochas leis an gCathaoirleach agus leis an gCeannaire. Ba mhaith liom, i dtosach báire, á rá go bhfuil mé chun leasú a dhéanamh agus a mholadh ar an Ord Gnó chun Bille nua a chur faoi bhráid an tSeanaid. Is é sin an Bille um Cheartas Coiriúil (Ógchiontóirí), 2023. I propose to the Leader and the House an amendment to the Order of Business on No. 22, the Criminal Justice (Juvenile Offenders) Bill 2023, which I would like to introduce today. This is a Bill I have drafted to deal with some gaps in sentencing and criminal justice law as they relate to children, in particular.

In this jurisdiction, we generally have quite a progressive regime under the Children Act 2001, which allows courts to specifically consider that they are sentencing a person who is a juvenile. That is the appropriate way because, in particular, at the beginning of a person’s life mistakes can be made and if certain punishments are handed down, it will end up in a lifetime of offending behaviour, which is something we want to avoid.

The Bill I am introducing does three things specifically. It addresses the mandatory life sentences that are applicable in respect of murder. If a person commits an offence for which he or she is ultimately convicted of murder before they are of the age of 18, but are convicted or sentenced after they are the age of 18, they are treated as an adult, notwithstanding the fact that they may have committed the offence as a child. Where a 15-year-old commits a murder today, if he or she is sentenced in three years' time, he or she is sentenced and is subject to a mandatory life sentence. That is an unnecessary and unseen fettering of judicial discretion and was never intended when the legislation for mandatory life sentences in respect of murder was made.

A second thing this Bill does is in respect of detention and supervision orders. At the moment the judges' hands are tied in this regard because they must have a half and half rule in respect of detention and supervision. It seems to me to be much more reasonable, particularly in the case of child offenders, that judicial discretion would allow them to decide what the appropriate length of the detention portion or the supervision portion of the sentence should be.

Third, this Bill deals with suspended sentences. The suspended sentences provision ,which was brought into law under section 99 of the Criminal Justice Act 2006, does not apply to juvenile offenders. That is a gap in the law and is something we can fix. I hope that the Leader will accept this amendment in respect of the Order of Business today.

Jerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I ask Senator Ward to confirm that he proposes that No. 22 be taken before No. 1.

Barry Ward (Fine Gael)
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Yes, I so propose I am aware that Senator Higgins also proposes an amendment and I do not mind whether it comes before or after No.22.

Jerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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Senator Higgins’s proposal will be dealt with first. I call Senator Mullen to speak now, please.

Rónán Mullen (Independent)
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Gabhaim míle buíochas leis an gCathaoirleach. Yesterday I was among the five persons appointed to a special committee of Seanad Éireann which will join of the special committee of the Dáil to form the Joint Committee on Assisted Dying, pursuant to motions passed in the Dáil and the Seanad. I first thank the Committee of Selection for supporting my application or request to be included on this committee. I am sure, together with the other four Members of the Seanad, that I will do my best to scrutinise the issues from my own particular perspective certainly, as I know they will. This will be with a close eye to be seen to do justice in this situation.

I put on record at this point that I have concerns about the terming of the committee as the joint committee on assisted dying. What is proposed here by some in these Houses is a change in the law that will make certain people very vulnerable to feeling that they do not belong in our society any more. We spend a great deal of time, effort and resources, rightly, in discouraging suicide. For me, this is a joint committee looking at the issue of assisted suicide and that is how I intend to term it. I believe that the committee that has been set up should seek to be known as the joint committee on assisted dying or assisted suicide because we must not have one term leading the way, as it were, or shaping public opinion one way or the other.

The other thing is that the wording of the main task of the joint committee suggests that we are there to “consider and make recommendations for legislative and/or policy change in relation to a statutory right to assist a person to end their life”. On one reading, that is telling us what we have to do, which is to come up with recommendations for policy change. Are we entitled to recommend against policy change? I believe this has been very badly worded and is an issue upon which I have written to the chairperson-designate of the committee, Deputy Michael Healy-Rae, to ask him to get a legal opinion to determine, first of all, whether we can change our title to becoming the joint committee on assisted dying or assisted suicide and, second, to verify that we in fact to have a free hand as we set about our exploration of the issues, hearing evidence, and to recommend for or against a policy or legislative change in this area. It is vital, if there is to be public confidence, that our hands are not seen to be tied right from the get-go. I thank the Cathaoirleach.

Tim Lombard (Fine Gael)
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Before making my main contribution, I formally second the proposal from Senator Ward.

We need to have a real debate about how we are going to deal with our vulnerable adults and how they can access the services they have. We have had a very significant debate in the past number of years about school transportation. Rightly or wrongly, there have been changes there. There is a lack of actual transportation to get vulnerable adults to their five-day a week services whether it is the Cope Foundation or CoAction. This is a very significant issue for us in society. They have access to transportation but when they reach the age of 18 they do not and are literally thrown off the bus. They need to find an avenue where they can have a continuous ability to get to these services and attend them on a five-day week scenario.

What is happening is that at present, 11 students in Beara will be obliged to travel on Irish Rural Link transportation in an unsupervised way from the next few weeks onwards, because there will be no other way in the future that they will be able to reach their services. I have been contacted by parents from Kilbrittain who go to Dunmanway every day, and this will be the case for the rest of their lives. They will need to access their services and take their vulnerable adult, who is now 18, to these services for the next 20 to 30 years, for as long as they are available. We have no policy as to how we are going to close this loop and I believe we must have a significant debate on this issue. It is not on the radar and is not being spoken about.As a result, families are tied and have no ability to have a life. They do so much for society and we need to help them. We should have a debate about prioritising transportation for vulnerable adults in order that they can live independent lives.

Ned O'Sullivan (Fianna Fail)
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I was at a meeting recently at which the question of NGOs came up. A person in the audience asked what an NGO is and as a public representative, I did my best to explain. It led to an interesting discussion and what came across to me was that the general public do not know much about NGOs, how they operate, who they represent and how they are established. There also seems to be concern that there is duplication, and I know about that from my experience on Oireachtas committees over the years. If an issue comes up, we are not confronted with or asked to meet one advocacy group but five, six, seven or eight of them, many of which are hard to differentiate from one other. In addition, there will more than likely be an umbrella advocacy group for those groups, which leads to layer upon layer of confusion.

I was also asked how the Government decides which NGOs get money and on what basis they are allocated money. If I, as an Oireachtas Member, do not know the answer to that question, the chances are that 90% of the public do not know either. I ask the Leader to see if it is possible for Government Information Service to produce some form of directory or guide to NGOs in Ireland. How do the NGOs take their titles? Some have grandiose titles like the national council for this or the institute for that. One example is the National Women's Council of Ireland. Women tell me they do not know what it does and that it seems to be a left-wing group that does not represent them. That is what I am hearing and I am just telling the truth and taking that organisation as an example. How do these organisations get their titles and assume a national identity if they are not representing maybe 90% of the community of women in that case?

It is time some sense was brought to this area. I am all for representative groups providing a service, information and advocacy for good causes. However, some idea needs to be given to us as to their priorities, how they are formed and funded, what their entitlements are, if they see themselves as helping groups or if they see their job as to attack Government, the church or other institutions. I would like to know about that issue in general.

Mark Wall (Labour)
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I support colleagues who raised yesterday's independent review group report on the Defence Forces. I thank again the Women of Honour and our colleague, Senator Clonan, on the considerable work they have done recently on what is, as I said yesterday, a national disgrace. It is important that we mention what the report findings are. The Tánaiste and Minister for Defence called this "a watershed moment" and that is correct. The findings show that of the 527 people spoken to, one third of respondents experienced harassment while serving in the Defence Forces. The most damning statistic I took from the report is that some 88% of females reported experiencing one or more forms of sexual harassment. That is damning and I know colleagues have mentioned this as well.

The issue we have raised is that the statutory inquiry must be up and running before the summer recess. That is essential for those who have fought so hard to get us to this day. The number of incidents of harassment over five years is unbelievable and some 7% of respondents report that it is ongoing. This is what is happening in our Defence Forces. As was said last night, fewer than 7% of those serving in the Defence Forces are female. That is unacceptable in this day and age. It is a national disgrace. We need to see the statutory inquiry up and running before the summer recess. I call on the Leader to ask the Minister for Defence to come to the House to discuss the findings of the report. It is essential that we also get the chance to discuss it in the Upper House. I thank the Women of Honour and our colleague, Senator Clonan, for the work they have done in bringing us to this day. It was essential. We have a report but what we need to see is action arising from that report.

Malcolm Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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I join others in welcoming the publication of yesterday's report. It is crucial that action is taken. Every workplace should be safe. The members of Women of Honour deserve to be recognised for their whistleblowing. They have done the State great service in so doing. Like Senator Wall, I recognise the work of our colleague, Senator Clonan, and Katie Hannon for the radio documentary that did much to bring attention to this issue.

In a Commencement debate this morning, I raised an issue I have often brought up in the House, namely, the deployment of closed-circuit television, CCTV, and other technology to catch illegal dumping. I have brought in legislation on this issue, as has Senator Wall. My Bill was eventually folded into the Circular Economy and Miscellaneous Provisions Act 2022, which was enacted last year. In the Commencement matter, I asked what progress had been made in commencing the order that would allow CCTV to be used by local authorities. I asked the same question last October of the Minister of State, Deputy Ossian Smyth, and nobody from the Department came in here to answer it. The Minister of State, Deputy O'Donovan, had to read out the answer that was provided. I have to question whether ChatGPT was being used in the Department to provide answers. Somebody in the Department of the Environment, Climate and Communications just asked for an answer to Malcolm Byrne raising questions again about the deployment of CCTV.

Rónán Mullen (Independent)
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Did they not just use the previous answer?

Malcolm Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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It was the previous answer. It was the Circular Economy and Miscellaneous Provisions Act 2022 by name and by nature. I will give an example. The reply I received last October stated:

In order to address data protection concerns, the Act also sets out a number of conditions that must be complied with prior to the introduction and the use of CCTV and other mobile recording devices by local authorities. The Local Government Management Agency, LGMA, is required to prepare and submit draft codes of practice to the Minister for approval.

It goes on and the same answer was provided to me this morning.It is not good enough. The issue is not being taken seriously. I am convinced that ChatGPT is being used for some of these replies.

Rónán Mullen (Independent)
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Full marks for recycling.

Malcolm Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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It is the circular economy. The Department is not taking the scourge of illegal dumping seriously.

Seán Kyne (Fine Gael)
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Tá an tAire Coimirce Sóisialaí, Heather Humphreys, ag déanamh athbhreithnithe ar chlár na mbéilí scoile. Tá an scéim an-tábhachtach do pháistí agus dá gcuid tuismitheoirí i scoileanna DEIS. Beidh an scéim seo ag tosnú i chuid de na scoileanna nach bhfuil páirteach i DEIS san fhómhar. Ní raibh aon ardú ar na rátaí ó 2003 ach tá méadú suntasach tagtha ar na costasaí do bhéilí a ullmhú ón am sin. Iarraim ar an gCeannaire scríobh arís chuig an Aire, an Teachta Humphreys, ag impí uirthi na rátaí a ardú. Tá na comhlachtaí ag fágáil na scéime seo mar nach bhfuil siad in ann béilí a chur ar fáil ar na praghsanna atá ceadaithe.

The hot school meals has been a wonderful Government initiative over the years and has provided much-needed food and meals in schools, predominantly DEIS schools, for some time. We know the importance of nutrition for children and young people focusing in school and performing at their best. Budget 2023 provided €94.4 million for the hot school meals programme and the Government has recently approved an additional €14.5 million to allow access to the programme for all remaining DEIS schools from September 2023. I know the Minister is carrying out a review and evaluation of the hot school meals programme and hopefully a decision will be announced soon. I ask the Leader to write to the Minister for Social Protection, Deputy Humphreys, to ask her to expedite that review and provide an update on the possibility of increasing the rates for the hot school meals programme, which have not changed since 2003. The costs of preparing and providing nutritious meals have increased. The standards are the same in terms of the need to provide quality and nutritious meals but the costs have increased and companies are not bothering to tender for the provision of hot school meals as a result. The Government is investing in rolling out the programme but companies are not tendering to provide meals. I ask the Leader to contact the Minister in this regard.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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I support Senator Kyne on the matter of school meals. I raised a Commencement matter before the House, and as I think other Senators did, and the results of this need to be dealt with as quickly as possible. As Senator Kyne has rightly said, people who provide the service are opting out. I was talking to some people providing that service. It is incredible. The reality is that they are not covered. I know people in some of our own towns who are providing the service from their local supermarket or whatever, and are doing a very good job. They are only doing it there to accommodate the schools and are barely breaking even with it.

I want to welcome the recent announcement by the Minister, Deputy McConalogue, on dog control and the new measures to the effect that there will be an extra 40 dog wardens and a doubling of the fines. This is quick action by a Minister who sees a difficulty. We have had a lot of talk for many years about this problem. I am disappointed with some who are saying this is not enough and will not work. It is a big improvement and a big step forward. We have had a public debate about it. As we move forward, I hope everybody will take responsibility for their dogs. The lack of responsibility sometimes by dog owners is shocking. We know accidents can happen and a dog can break away and unfortunately attack sheep. An attack on sheep is just an incredibly horrible thing to happen. It causes stress to the animals and distress to families and young people in families. It is one of the most horrific things that can happen. Unfortunately, sheep are not able to fight back in any shape or form and they become huge victims of the attack. This is good action by a Minister who really sees what needs to be done. As we move forward, I hope we will see fewer attacks on sheep. Hopefully we will get this legislation through as quickly as possible to protect the flock and not see animals completely destroyed by dogs. We also have to realise that dogs have to be kept under control and under watch all the time.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Senator O'Sullivan raised a very important question which could lead to a very important debate in this Chamber. We could have a very good debate. How many NGOs are there in the country? I would say there are hundreds of them. Are they all funded or fully funded by the Government? Is it the Department of the Taoiseach or the Department of Foreign Affairs which funds them or is every Department funding different NGOs? We could have a very good debate on that aspect of things.

Will Leader organise a debate in the Chamber on public transport, that is, our buses and trains? There is no doubt at all that we have seen a huge uplift in the number of people who are using trains and buses. It may be the fact that there are more trains and more buses to be used or that their fares came down, as happened recently, which has led to the increase in public transport use. Maybe it is the decisions that the Government and the Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications, Deputy Eamon Ryan, are making in relation to getting cars off the road. Certainly, if that is the case, this is working in some regards. However, we need more buses and trains, particularly from the west of Ireland. The Westport to Ballina train needs a few extra services, particularly a mid-morning train to Dublin and a late evening train at 7 or 8 o'clock. The last train leaves Heuston Station for Westport or Ballina at 6.15 p.m. which is quite early in the evening for somebody who is coming to Dublin, doing a day's work and wanting to get back home again that evening. It is not as flexible as it could be. Even if there was some connectivity to Athlone where people could get the Galway trains. I request a debate on public transport so we can see how it is working, the usage that is happening, and where else we could go from there.

Paul Gavan (Sinn Fein)
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Senators may have seen the report that the Economic and Social Research Institute, ESRI, released today on the deficit of hospital beds across our health service. Right now, we are 1,000 beds short. The ESRI also recommends we add an additional 300 beds per year after that as well. It will come as no surprise to anyone from Limerick, given the horrendous state of the hospital for years now in terms of bed capacity. However, it is worrying. It is interesting to note that our bed capacity has increased in recent years but for decades it reduced. From the 1980s right through to 2011, each successive Government cut back hospital beds. Indeed, many people would argue the health service has never fully recovered from the horrendous cutbacks implemented by Fianna Fáil in the late 1980s. The Senators might recall that Fianna Fáil Deputies got elected on the back of posters across the country that said that "health cuts hurt the old, the sick and the handicapped". Excuse that last expression; it is what they used. The Government then implemented the most savage cutbacks of any Government ever in terms of health, which is saying something.

My concern is that we need to have a debate about this because our population is growing by 1% a year, the numbers of those over 65 are growing by 3.5% a year and we know we do not have enough beds right now. Over the past ten years, approximately 100 beds per year have been added. The ESRI is telling us we need 300 beds per year. It will require a lot more capital investment than the current Government has committed to. We need to have that conversation.

On one further point, when we talk about capacity, we also need to have a conversation about accurate numbers of patients on hospital trolleys. At 9.30 this morning, the Irish Nurses and Midwives Organisation, INMO, tells us there were 99 patients in University Hospital Limerick but the official HSE figure is 37. Yesterday, the numbers on trolleys were 98 versus 29. There is one and a half hours between those figures being taken; one was taken at 8 a.m. and the other at 9.30 a.m. I trust the INMO. I think those figures from the HSE are a work of fiction, frankly. We need to call that out. We know there is a crisis across our hospitals. The HSE needs to come to the table with honest figures about that crisis.

Lynn Boylan (Sinn Fein)
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Hear, hear.

Robbie Gallagher (Fianna Fail)
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Like my colleague Senator Burke, I support Senator O'Sullivan's proposal to have a discussion on NGOs. It would be a very worthwhile and very interesting discussion and I would certainly welcome it.

This morning I will discuss penalty points. Penalty points are designed to encourage safe driving and to reduce casualties on our roads. If a person drives over the speed limit, he or she gets three penalty points and an initial fixed-charge fine of €160. Most drivers, as we know, are careful and responsible on the roads but might occasionally be caught driving over the speed limit, for example doing 54 km/h or 55 km/h in a 50 km zone. Such drivers are clearly over the speed limit - there is no issue with that - and therefore are rightly liable to pay the penalty. However, questions arise sometimes when a careless and reckless driver who drives at 90 km/h in the same zone receives the same number of penalty points. There is clearly an absence of fairness in that respect. I did a bit of research on the approach taken to this matter in a number of jurisdictions. California has introduced what it calls a tiered approach. There are actually four main headings for speeding. The first tier is those driving between 1 and 15 miles per hour - as it is over there - over the limit. The second tier is anybody driving between 16 and 25 miles per hour over the limit, the third is between 26 and 100 miles per hour over the limit, and the fourth is anybody driving over 100 miles per hour. The rise in penalty depends on the level of speed. If the driver's speeding falls into a certain category, he or she gets a certain fine. Such a system has merit and deserves to be explored. I propose that the Leader should ask the Minister for Transport to come before the House to have a discussion on this. I feel such a system would impose greater penalties on the greater offence which would surely be worth considering in the interest of fairness.

Maria Byrne (Fine Gael)
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I welcome the announcement by Shannon Airport this morning that passenger numbers are up 21% compared to 2019 and up 22% on 2022. This is really good not only for Limerick but also for the mid-west region. There are currently 33 destinations available from Shannon Airport, with flights to 11 countries including the UK, the US and European countries. Certainly, the new routes announced today to Naples, Porto, Béziers, Newcastle and Liverpool are most welcome. A flight to O'Hare International Airport in Chicago will start in May. It is a good news story for the mid-west and for Shannon Airport. I compliment Mary Considine, the CEO, and the staff of the airport. As people are beginning to arrange their summer holidays, Shannon Airport is an airport that is very easily accessed. From parking a car to going through security, it is very easy to access.I wish the management team and staff at Shannon Airport all the best.

I support the call by Senators Kyne and Murphy to have a debate in the House on the hot school meals programme. There are two companies in the mid-west, which is my area, that are supplying hot meals to schools right across the country. It is really important that children are able to have a hot, nutritious meal in school. However, there has been no increase in the amount of money being paid to the suppliers to provide the meals. Companies with rising costs are finding it very difficult to keep providing the meals at the same price. This issue must be addressed. Will the Leader contact the Minister's office about it?

Eileen Flynn (Independent)
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I second Senator Higgins's amendment to the Order of Business.

This morning, a Speak Out against Racism event was launched in the Leinster House audiovisual room. Young women, many of them students, spoke out on the impact of racism. Yesterday, I asked about the progress of the Criminal Justice (Incitement to Violence or Hatred and Hate Offences) Bill 2022 but did not get a reply. I would like to know where it is at and whether we can have a debate on these issues in the House. I bring up this topic nearly every week. Now more than ever, we need strong hate crime legislation to ensure people feel safer. It is not about putting people in prison. It is about making people from minority groups and people of colour feel safer within society.

Martin Conway (Fine Gael)
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Ennis 2040 is a great concept. It is about planning professionally for the future we want to see for Ennis, which is the capital town of Clare and sits between Limerick and Galway. It is a great initiative and I am very supportive of it. However, I am concerned by a proposal from the Ennis 2040 team to upgrade Abbey Street car park, in the process of which it is seeking to purchase properties on Francis Street and demolish them to make way for a supposedly temporary car park. Why on earth would one knock down houses in a housing crisis to build a temporary car park that is planned to be relocated in the future? In addition, my understanding is that a major retailer is on the brink of pulling out of considering the centre of Ennis as a location for a much-needed retail opportunity and investment, which the people of the town would welcome with open arms.

I call for a debate on designated activity companies, DACs, which are vehicles that are being set up by local authorities to implement certain projects. There is a DAC for the Cliffs of Moher Experience. I, as a public representative, do not know what the profits are for that facility every year. I do know that the road network surrounding the Cliffs of Moher centre badly needs to be upgraded, as do the footpaths and the public realm in the villages and towns surrounding it. We are in a situation in which millions of euro are going into the Cliffs of Moher visitor centre every year but no part of that funding is being put towards improving the road network, streetscape and public realm in the area.

Ennis 2040 is also managed by a DAC. As a public representative in County Clare, I have received no briefing on the proposals to demolish homes to facilitate the construction of a temporary car park. I ask for a debate in the House with the Minister to find out the Department's view and position on these DACs.

Jerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I welcome Senator Matt Harrington from the state of Maine in the US, who is a guest of the Leas-Chathaoirleach. Senator Harrington was elected last December from the 33rd district to the Maine Senate. He and his wife Lauren are very welcome. I understand he won his seat with an impressive 54% of the vote. We could all take a leaf out of his book. I congratulate him and wish him well on his trip. I hope that as part of the Leas-Chathaoirleach's state legislature engagement programme, Senator Harrington will continue to forge links with us here in Seanad Éireann.

Aisling Dolan (Fine Gael)
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All of us in attendance at the Ballinasloe Town Hall Theatre last Saturday had a great night watching the story of the von Trapp family climbing every mountain in The Sound of Music. It was an absolutely incredible production and the children in the cast were outstanding. The dedication and commitment of every member of the cast was clear, from the age of six or seven upwards. The youngest member came from Tullamore. There were people from Tuam and Galway city coming to rehearsals in Ballinasloe. I congratulate the cast and production crew. It is a great achievement for the town to be able to put on such a show. The people of the town and region showed overwhelming support, with sell-out concerts every night and in the matinee slots. Somebody said to me in passing that the quality was such that the play could have been showing on Broadway. The quality of the music, the singing and the cast was that high. Small towns can do great things and this is just one example of it. I acknowledge the work of the Ballinasloe Musical Society, under the leadership of Frances Leahy, which is celebrating its 100th anniversary this year and is hoping to have an event celebrating it in October. We are there to support arts, music and heritage in our local and regional areas and this is a great example of it.

Mary Fitzpatrick (Fianna Fail)
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I commend and congratulate everybody involved in the Five Lamps Arts Festival, which brings the north inner city to life from a cultural perspective. It celebrates everything that is great about Dublin's north inner city, our diversity and heritage, including everything from the built heritage through to the literary heritage and the natural heritage. I congratulate the organisers, volunteers and everybody who has performed in, contributed to and participated in the festival.

I again raise the situation of Gaelscoil Choláiste Mhuire, which is located on Parnell Square, at the top of O'Connell Street. The school has waited patiently for 20 years, in temporary accommodation, for its own purpose-built school. When I was a city councillor, I was proud and delighted to support the transfer of land on Dominick Street for the building of a new purpose-built school. Over the past ten years, the progress has been glacial. It has been painfully slow. I was really pleased that in the past two years, working with the Minister for Education, Deputy Foley, we have made significant progress, with the project going to planning and to tender. It is heartbreaking for the pupils, teachers and the whole school community that all of that work and accelerated progress in the past two years has now ground to a halt in the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform. It is unacceptable for the pupils, teachers and the whole school community. There is a cost to not moving forward. This project is shovel-ready and has a tender that can be accepted. The time for doing cost-benefit analysis is well and truly over. I would appreciate if the Leader would raise this issue with the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform and ask it to release the funds immediately in order that the project can go ahead.

Garret Ahearn (Fine Gael)
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I ask for a debate with the Minister for Social Protection on the back-to-school clothing and footwear allowance, which is a really important provision for people on social welfare and working people on very low incomes. The challenge we have had over the past year is that the increase in the cost of living means everyone is struggling significantly. We need to get to a point where the scheme, which is available for a certain number of people in the country, is expanded further. The Minister has done a lot in expanding schemes in other areas and this is one that needs to be prioritised. We are in a situation now in which large numbers of working parents are going into debt to send their children to school. A survey last year showed it costs approximately €1,500 to get a secondary student ready for the start of the school year. That is just for one child. It is a very costly time of year for parents and the extension of the allowance is something that needs to be considered.In this time of rising inflation and a high cost of living, we should consider expanding that further for parents.

There will be special meeting of Tipperary County Council on the issue of housing today. Similar meetings are happening across the country. I presume the same will happen in the Leader's constituency in Mayo. Sinn Féin has put forward this initiative. It has asked all councils to have special meetings. It is another waste of time. The irony in Tipperary is that the five names that have been put down, which comprise two Sinn Féin members and three other members of Tipperary County Council, are the names of those who object to housing most frequently. What those councils are doing is bringing everyone who works in the housing department in to talk to them about housing for the day, which means that no one in Tipperary is going to receive any housing from the housing department because all the staff have to go to discuss the problems with housing and be answerable to the people who are causing the problems. We talk about housing in the two Chambers in Leinster House. Councillors are on the ground and working for people, trying their best to help. Having political stunts up here is one thing but imposing them on councillors in all councils around the country is another. It is an utter waste of time.

Lisa Chambers (Fianna Fail)
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I thank all Members who contributed to the Order of Business. Senator Joe O'Reilly spoke this morning about the issue of gambling, which Senator Cassells also spoke about. I am pleased to inform the House that the Bill has commenced in the Dáil and is due to come before the Seanad before the summer recess in July. I am not sure it will pass all Stages before the recess but we would love it to do so. The comments made by both Senators show there is a willingness and momentum to put an end to that scourge on Irish society. It is a message to the gambling companies that the good times are coming to an end. The regulator will be well resourced and equipped. It will have teeth to deal with the appalling practices that go on and advertising targeted not just at vulnerable people but at young children. As I said, those days are coming to an end and it is long overdue.

Senators O'Loughlin, Boyhan, Wall and Malcolm Byrne raised the issue of the Defence Forces report, the Women of Honour and the shocking independent review group, IRG, report. While we have been made aware of many of the issues raised in the report, it was still a shocking read for anybody who perused it yesterday. I again commend the Women of Honour for their bravery and their long-standing campaign to get this issue to where it is. We are not finished yet. I also commend our colleague, Senator Tom Clonan, who first published his findings on this issue 23 years ago. It has been a long road for him and his family. He spoke yesterday of the consistent and constant reprisal and abuse he has received while trying to bring this issue to light. We will now have a statutory inquiry, which is something the Women of Honour sought. I am pleased that will be the next step. I heard one of the Women of Honour on the radio this morning speak graciously about the organisation. She said the organisation has pride and its members can serve with pride. There is an opportunity now to improve the organisation and make it a safe workplace for the women and men who serve in Óglaigh na hÉireann.

Senator O'Loughlin also spoke about the ESB and its record profits of €840 million last year. She asked how a company can make such profits in light of the excessive and extortionate bills that many consumers are trying to pay.

Senator Boyhan spoke about the Order of Business and a couple of key debates that will happen today on St. John Ambulance and Inland Fisheries Ireland. He also welcomed the unveiling of the John Hume statue. He has requested a debate on the shared island initiative.

Senator Boylan spoke about neutrality, as did Senator Higgins. We would probably disagree about some aspects of the issue, which will come as no surprise. I have a different view about what PESCO means. It is a matter of opting in to certain projects. I do not believe it undermines neutrality. The Government position was and is that we are fully committed to Ireland's neutrality as it stands. There is no effort at all to chip away at our neutrality or water it down, to use the Senator's words. However, we also need to acknowledge that we are not operating in isolation. We are members of the European Union. We also need to protect our own country, which means collaborating with other like-minded member states on key projects through PESCO and in other ways.

Senator Higgins proposed an amendment to the Order of Business to have No. 21 taken before No. 1. I am happy to accept that amendment, which was seconded by Senator Flynn.

Senator Crowe spoke about sentencing in the courts. I am conscious of the sensitivities around the topic. The Senator highlighted issues concerning the public response to some sentences that have been publicised in recent times. He said there is the appearance of lenient sentences for very severe crimes and has asked for a debate on the issue. There are two courts Bills due in the Chamber after Easter and that might provide an opportunity to question the Minister on that issue. If that is not sufficient, we can always revisit the issue but there will be two opportunities to engage with the Minister after the Easter recess.

Senator Ward proposed an amendment, seconded by Senator Lombard, to the Order of Business to the effect that No. 22 be taken before No. 1. I am happy to accept that amendment. I commend the Senator for his work in identifying and addressing gaps in our legislation. I agree with what he said about children being sentenced at a later stage, when they become adults, when the offence in question was committed when they were minors. That is a gap that needs to be closed. I agree that it was an unintended consequence. It was not the intention of the legislation.

Senator Mullen spoke about being appointed as one of the five Seanad Members to the assisted dying committee. He made a number of points about the title of that committee. He has requested that the title be changed to the assisted dying and assisted suicide committee to facilitate the viewpoints of all members. He also spoke about the potential impacts for vulnerable people. I have no doubt but that the Senator will perform his duties to a very high standard and will represent a part of our society. It is important that those voices are represented at all Oireachtas committees.

Senator Lombard raised the issue of vulnerable adults and transport to services. Once they turn 18, they do not have access to transport. I suggest the Senator put down a Commencement matter because it is a specific issue. That might yield sufficient information or flag the issue with the Minister.

A request was made by Senator O'Sullivan, supported by Senators Paddy Burke and Gallagher, for a debate to examine the issue of NGOs, including how they are established and funded, how they operate and how many of them there are. I will make that request to the Minister. The Senator made a point about a public information campaign by the Government Information Service. That might be a good question to ask as a Commencement matter, as it is niche and specific. However, we will certainly seek a wider debate on that area. The Senator made an interesting point. He posed a question around the National Women's Council, for example. While the word "national" is in the title of the organisation, I would agree with the Senator that many women do not feel represented by the National Women's Council. That is only one example and my intention is not to single out that organisation. However, one would wonder how an organisation gets such a title and represents a particular viewpoint when it is not representing everybody. That is an interesting debate in which the public might also be interested.

Senator Wall, as I said, spoke about the Defence Forces report.He asked for the Minister for Defence to come to the House. The Tánaiste will be in the House to discuss that issue on 25 April.

Senator Malcolm Byrne spoke about CCTV footage for illegal dumping and raised an issue around getting the same response on two separate occasions that did not really answer his question. I will liaise with the Senator and see whether we can elicit a more detailed response form the Department of the Environment, Climate and Communications on when the commencement order will be signed.

Senators Kyne, Murphy and Maria Byrne all raised the issue of the hot school meals programme. There seem to be challenges in getting companies to tender at current rates, even though significant funding, which was in excess of €90 million in the previous budget, is being provided by the Government. We will request a debate on that. I might also suggest a Commencement matter from all three Senators to see whether we can get an update on that. There are issues in that the cost of providing meals that has gone up. The cost of food has gone up. We know that. It is one of the most significant increases in terms of inflation. We probably need to keep step with that if we are going to provide the same standard of meals to students across the country and expand the programme.

Senator Murphy raised an issue around dog owners and the issue of dogs attacking sheep.

Senator Paddy Burke requested a debate on public transport and capacity issues. I certainly agree with the Senator in terms of the availability of public transport to certain parts of the country. He raised on a previous day the issue of the last train to County Mayo leaving at 6.15 p.m. In reality, a person would want to be on his or her way to Heuston Station by 5 p.m. in order to actually make the train. It is not very flexible for those travelling for appointments or work. I know from a recent engagement with Iarnród Éireann that the issue is one of carriages. It does not have enough trains to put on the tracks. It is looking to purchase new carriages, but it could be 2024 before it has additional carriages. I understand the focus will be on putting extra capacity in Dublin but there are plans to roll out more carriages, excuse the pun, to other parts of the country as well. There is also talk of a later service to Mayo, potentially leaving Dublin at 8 p.m. I am not sure at what stage that is at in terms of securing it, however.

Senator Gavan spoke about the ESRI report and the need for additional hospital beds. It is important to acknowledge that there has been a significant increase in hospital beds in the last decade. We are up to more than 1,000 additional beds. We have a bit of catch-up to do. There is an acknowledgement that we need more beds, but we need staff to man those beds. It is not simply about putting in a physical bed; we need the staff to go with it. There are acknowledged challenges in terms of recruiting staff into the health sector.

Senator Gallagher spoke about penalty points and the suggestion that a tiered approach might be more appropriate whereby those who are slightly above the speed limit would not get the same penalty points as those who are excessively above the speed limit.

Senator Maria Byrne welcomed the additional routes into Shannon Airport and congratulated Ms Mary Considine and her team at the airport on the 20% increase in passenger numbers over the last couple of years. It is a great success. The regional airports have been doing quite well in the last couple of years. Knock Airport recently added a flight connection into Heathrow Airport, which is one of the major international hubs. It was a huge coup for the airport and its staff had been working on it for many years. Equally, Shannon Airport has also been doing exceptionally well. It is good to see a greater balancing of air travel around the country, which is also taking a little bit of pressure off the capital.

Senator Flynn spoke about the Speak Out against Racism briefing in the audiovisual room, which I believe kicked off at 12 o'clock. I wish the representative group well for the briefing. It may be coming to a close very soon so as many people as possible should get there and pop in. I thank the group for taking the time to come in and brief Oireachtas Members on that really important issue.

Senator Conway asked a specific question and raised some issues around designated activity companies that are mainly related to County Clare. I might suggest a Commencement matter on that issue.

Senator Dolan spoke as she often does about Ballinasloe. We are all very well versed in what is happening in Ballinasloe on a weekly basis; good on her. She spoke about Ballinasloe Town Hall Theatre telling the story of the von Trapp family. She told us about the number of children who participated in the programme, which was really good for the community.

Senator Fitzpatrick spoke about Dublin's north inner city and the benefits of the Five Lamps Arts Festival to the community. The Senator then raised a very important issue around schools and Gaelscoil Choláiste Mhuire in the inner city. It has been using temporary accommodation for 20 years, which is just shocking. It is ready to have a shovel put in the ground and build but the brakes have been applied, in effect, by the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform. A number of schools, one of which is in my own area, are at an advanced stage as well. Students and staff were expecting the school to be delivered at a certain point but the brakes have been put on. It is hugely upsetting for those school communities. Much work is going on behind the scenes with the Minister, Deputy Foley, the Taoiseach, the Tánaiste and the Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform to get these schools moving again. I understand the need for oversight and cost-benefit analysis to ensure that public money is spent properly, but these schools were ready to move. We had already passed the planning and tendering stages. These schools need to be allowed to pass through and then we can do the other bit of work that is required.

Senator Ahearn asked for a debate on social protection. We will seek that debate with the Minister, Deputy Humphreys. I have requested the Minister for other issues so we will get a debate with her most likely after Easter and hopefully before the summer recess. The Senator spoke about the special meetings that are being called in local authorities. The points he raised are very important to put on the floor of the House. It shows the hypocrisy of those members who are calling these special meetings. The Senator rightly pointed out that the practical impacts are that housing staff are not available to deal with housing queries on the day and that very often, the members requesting are the ones who are objecting to housing. It shows that it is being used as a political tool, which is really unhelpful. It is important that we call that out. The meeting will come and go, but we will continue to focus on getting the job done of delivering homes. That is what we are about.

Senator Cassells spoke earlier about the issue of gambling. We look forward to debating the Gambling Regulation Bill 2022 in the House at the earliest opportunity, certainly before the summer recess.

Jerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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Senator Higgins has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business: "That No. 21 be taken before No. 1." It has been seconded by Senator Flynn. The Leader has indicated that she is prepared to accept this amendment. Is the amendment agreed to? Agreed.

Senator Ward has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business: "That No. 22 be taken before No. 1." It has been seconded by Senator Lombard. The Leader has indicated that she is prepared to accept this amendment. Is the amendment agreed to? Agreed.