Seanad debates

Wednesday, 18 December 2019

Nithe i dtosach suíonna - Commencement Matters

Alcohol Pricing

10:30 am

Photo of Paul CoghlanPaul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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The Minister of State, Deputy Byrne, is very welcome. I call Senator Buttimer.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I thank Minister of State, Deputy Byrne, for attending. I am a former Chairman of the health committee, which engaged in pre-legislative scrutiny of the Public Health (Alcohol) Bill 2015 which became the Public Health (Alcohol) Act 2018. The Minister of State, who was a very valued member of the committee, is now Minister of State at the Department of Health. We have been waiting on the enactment of the minimum pricing part of the Public Health (Alcohol) Act 2018 since October 2018. If Members and people watching or listening to the proceedings today have observed the advertising of alcohol and alcohol being used as a loss leader by the retail sector over the last couple of months, they could only be but alarmed.

Photo of Paul CoghlanPaul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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It is in the newspapers every day.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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It is every day, a Leas-Chathaoirligh. If one compares prices over a ten-year period, a bottle of Jameson is €20 today, while it was €26.99 in 2009. A 700 ml bottle of Smirnoff was €30.99 in 2009, while it is €22.49 today. A bottle of Bailey's is €10 today, while it was €18.60 in 2009. A bottle of Hennessey is €25 today, while it was €30.99 in 2009. A bottle of Bacardi is €15 today, while it was €24.99 in 2009. Those are just examples. I could have picked beer.

Photo of Paul CoghlanPaul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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I wish to add that I have seen ads for one of those brands with a 1 l bottle for €20.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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Yes. Some shops are advertising that a person can buy two for €20 or €30. I am not complaining about the retailers, a Leas-Chathaoirligh, but we have a problem with below-cost selling. I want to ensure local businesses survive and jobs are created. However, we have not dealt with the misuse of alcohol. I refer to the importance of the Public Health (Alcohol) Bill 2015. We had very stringent debates around particular sections of that Bill, now the Public Health (Alcohol) Act 2018 in this House.

We must have a sensible approach to alcohol, to the selling of alcohol, in terms of its pricing, and to the way in which we sell and serve alcohol. We must also ensure that the retail sector is responsible, and by and large, it is responsible.

I refer to the price. VAT at 23% is included in the prices I mentioned. It demonstrates that VAT returns are being lost and what damage is being done. Young people now are buying alcohol more cheaply and more easily than a decade ago. The price of alcohol in our retail sector is very cheap.

The alcohol Act was a roadmap which we, as a State, signed up to. I know we were waiting on Scotland and on the EU ruling.

If one takes, for example, the loyalty card in Dunnes Stores, a person can get money back on a variety of goods, including alcohol. If a person spends €50, he or she may get €10 back. However, a person cannot use it on baby products. A mother or father buying nappies or baby products cannot use that.

Photo of Paul CoghlanPaul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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The Senator is very attentive in his shopping, I must say.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I try to be. What I am saying is that alcohol is so cheap and the retail sector is using it in the way I have described. Why can Dunnes, for example, not say to the mum and dad, the single mother, the two dads or the two mums that they may use the loyalty card to buy nappies or other baby products for their kids rather than alcohol?

We need to see a change around the price of alcohol. Let us make the minimum unit pricing Act we passed come into effect.

Photo of Catherine ByrneCatherine Byrne (Dublin South Central, Fine Gael)
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I will address some of the questions Senator Buttimer raised. I thank him for raising this matter.

The Public Health (Alcohol) Act was enacted on 17 October 2018. On 1 November the Minister, Deputy Harris, commenced 23 of its 31 sections. Some of these sections have already become law. By restricting the advertising and promotion of alcohol, they are changing the environment in which our children will grow up.

Last November three of the advertising provisions of the Act came into force. One provided that alcohol advertising in or on public service vehicles and at public transport stops and stations was prohibited. Alcohol advertisements were also prohibited from within 200 m of a school, crèche or local authority playground. Alcohol advertising in cinemas was prohibited except in a licensed area and around films with an 18 certificate. Children's clothing that promotes alcohol was banned.

Next year, on 12 November, our supermarkets and other mixed retail outlets will look different as alcohol products and their advertising will be confined to either a single area of the shop which will be separated by a 1.2 m high barrier, or storage units in which alcohol products cannot be seen up to a height of 1.5 m, or a maximum of three standard storage units with no visibility restrictions. In addition to these areas of the shop, alcohol products will be allowed to be stored, but not be visible, in a unit behind the counter.

From 12 November 2021 there will be a prohibition on alcohol advertising in sports areas during sporting events, at events that are aimed at children or at events in which the majority of participants or competitors are children. Alcohol sponsorship of events which are aimed at children or events in which the majority of participants or competitors are children will also be prohibited. Finally, driving or racing events involving motor vehicles will no longer be allowed to be sponsored by alcohol companies from November 2021.

Eight sections of the Act have yet to be commenced. These include section 12, on the labelling of alcohol products, and section 13, on the content of advertisements for alcohol products. These two sections will not be commenced until the regulations which must be made under them have been finalised and submitted for assessment at EU level. Once those regulations have exited the EU process, the Minister, Deputy Harris, will commence the sections. Businesses will know well in advance exactly what their obligations will be in respect of the labelling and advertising of their products.

We are determined to implement minimum unit pricing as soon as possible. When the Government of the day approved the drafting of a Public Health (Alcohol) Bill in 2013, it specified that implementation of minimum pricing should happen simultaneously both north and south of the Border in order to meet concerns about possible impacts on cross-Border trade. The suspended Administration in Northern Ireland has meant that our colleagues have not been able to progress their legislation. The coming weeks may see developments in this regard, but if the implementation of minimum unit pricing continues to be delayed, the Minister for Health intends to seek a revised Government decision to allow minimum pricing to be implemented here without the need for simultaneous implementation in Northern Ireland.

I met the Scottish Cabinet Secretary for Health and Sport at the British-Irish Council and we discussed minimum unit pricing. One thing he said was that since Scotland had brought it in, it had resulted in a huge reduction in the amount of cheap alcohol sold, particularly to young and more vulnerable people. He also said there was no evidence of people crossing from Scotland into England to buy cheaper alcohol there.

The health and well-being of our young people is very important, and we all know the difficulties they face and the pressures on them. Today we see many young people drinking a lot earlier, even at the age of 11 or 12, so it is really important that when we take legislation such as this through the Seanad or the Dáil we act as quickly as we can. Unfortunately, what has happened in the North has delayed the implementation of minimum unit pricing. I am assured by the Minister, Deputy Harris, however, that he will seek a Government decision to allow minimum unit pricing to be implemented as soon as possible. This does not have to be in conjunction with Northern Ireland if the Northern Ireland Assembly is not back up and running by the time of implementation.

I will speak to some of the other points the Senator made in my supplementary response.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister of State for her response and her personal commitment. The main point is that retailers are using alcohol products, particularly those with high alcohol by volume, such as whiskey and vodka, to drive footfall and increase market share. As the Minister of State said, young people today are drinking at an earlier age and drinking a variety of alcohol products. Minimum unit pricing, judging from our work on the committee and debate in the Houses of the Oireachtas, is an important part of combating cheap alcohol products. The risk to public health from such products is too great. I accept that the Minister of State's commitment is unquestionable.

It is important we ask the retailers, such as Dunnes Stores with its VALUEclub, to give money back to parents for use on baby products, not just alcohol.

Photo of Catherine ByrneCatherine Byrne (Dublin South Central, Fine Gael)
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In September the Minister, Deputy Harris, submitted a draft regulation made under the Public Health (Alcohol) Act for assessment of compatibility with EU law and initial market principles. The purpose of the regulations is to restrict pricing promotions of alcohol products. Now that the EU assessment process is complete, it is the Minister's intention to make those regulations in the new year and prohibit the use of loyalty card points on alcohol products, the sale of alcohol products at a reduced price or free of charge on the purchase of another product or service, and short-term price promotions of alcohol products. There will be a one-year lead-in time for businesses and consumers to prepare for these changes.

These regulations and minimum unit pricing are both designed to ensure that alcohol products can no longer be sold at a very low price. Together with these measures we will continue with our objective of delaying the initiation of alcohol use by young children and young people. We will also ensure that the price of alcohol reflects the serious nature of the harms caused when it is misused.

I thank Senator Buttimer for raising this matter. I look forward to continued support from this House on this very important process of reducing the level of drinking, particularly among young people and people who are very vulnerable. There is a mirror image in Scotland in that minimum unit pricing has been introduced there and has reduced the amount of alcohol being drunk, particularly among vulnerable and young children. We will continue with that.

I agree with Senator Buttimer about loyalty cards. As someone who shops in Dunnes all the time, I am very conscious that I pick up nappies and baby food for the children we have at home and that the loyalty card does not give young parents the opportunity to avail of discounts on such products. However, it is for those who want to buy three or four bottles of spirits from the shop. I will raise the matter again with the Minister, Deputy Harris, during the day.