Seanad debates

Thursday, 29 March 2018

10:30 am

Photo of Gerald NashGerald Nash (Labour)
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I raise an important matter concerning the Taxi Regulator and the treatment of the next of kin of deceased taxi licence and plate holders. As the Minister will understand, taxi owners form an integral part of the public transport system. They are largely self-employed and work hard to earn what can only be described as very modest incomes. They comply with the law and pay their taxes and have been subject to an increased degree of regulation in recent years, which has helped to professionalise the industry and root out many of the dubious elements who had been involved in recent decades. The Minister will concede that they and their families are entitled to have a fair crack of the whip.

I wish to share with the House and the Minister the shocking experience of a Drogheda woman, Ms Marie Keegan, at the hands of this bureaucracy. Marie's husband-----

Photo of Paul CoghlanPaul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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We are not supposed to name particular people.

Photo of Gerald NashGerald Nash (Labour)
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It is important in order to illustrate the point. This woman has spoken publicly and has no difficulty being referred to in the House. Her husband was a taxi driver for almost 30 years. When the business was deregulated in 2000, he bought his own plate like thousands of others. He worked hard for 17 or 18 years as the owner of that plate and met all of the industry regulations with which he had to comply. Tragically, Tommy died in Lanzarote while on holidays in January. His sudden passing was an unspeakable tragedy for Marie and Tommy's wider circle of friends in the Drogheda area.

In recent weeks and in an effort to tie up the loose ends that occur when someone passes away, Marie, with the help of Tommy's colleagues in Drogheda, contacted the Taxi Regulator to make arrangements for the transfer of the taxi licence to her. What happened next came as a shock. The regulator stated that the licence that Tommy owned in effect died with him. Marie was told that a little known form called the S15N had not been filled in by him in order to nominate her in the event of his passing. In the absence of that form being signed, the licence simply reverted to the regulator.

Not only has Marie had to deal with the unspeakable grief of suddenly losing her husband in very difficult circumstances, but she now has to deal with the reality of losing his business and a critical source of income for her as well. This has been described by many in the media and Marie herself as something akin to stealing from her husband. I would have to agree with that analogy.

There is another case of a woman who has spoken publicly on "Liveline" in recent weeks, that of Carol Lee, who lost her husband Mick, a taxi driver of long standing. Her circumstances directly mirror the experience of Marie Keegan in Drogheda. She has lost her husband's taxi licence. She made contact with the Taxi Regulator only to be told that, because this form had not been filled in, the licence essentially died with him. It seems to me that the taxi sector is not broadly familiar with this system. There does not seem to be any appeal or discretion and there is no human understanding whatsoever of the situation in which people like Marie Keegan find themselves. Surely, a taxi licence is an asset and, like any other asset, it can be transferred through a person's estate to next of kin in the normal way. I believe this has been dealt with in a cold, callous and inhumane fashion. I call on the Minister to respond on the associated policy matters and to commit to working with the National Transport Authority, NTA, which is the regulator of taxis, to try to divine a way in which this matter can be resolved in the interests of the next of kin of deceased taxi drivers who have not filled in this nomination form. They find not only that they have to deal with the grief of losing a family member but they have the difficulty of losing their business too.

Photo of Shane RossShane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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I thank Senator Nash for raising this issue, which is one that has obviously caused great distress. I wish to express my sympathy for the widow on the death of her husband in this case. I understand the distress she is suffering and the expectation that she might have received something that she has not. My guess is that the human elements of this are extremely worrying for the family and that we probably have uncovered a somewhat complicated issue that has the capacity to cause unexpected distress to bereaved people, something they could do without at a time of grieving.

As the Senator is probably aware, under the Taxi Regulation Act 2013, the NTA is the independent regulator of the taxi, hackney and limousine sectors. Technically, these are known in the legislation as small public service vehicles or SPSVs. Section 15 of the Act deals with the transfer of SPSV licences in the event of death. The 2013 Act sets out new rules and arrangements relating to licences for small public service vehicles. It took account of a review of the taxi industry conducted in 2011. Recommendations arising from the review were widely publicised at the time through the media, the NTA website and industry updates. Action 14 of the published report recommended the introduction of a general prohibition of the transferability of taxi licences. The measure was provided for in section 41 of the Taxi Regulation Act 2013, which was commenced with effect from 6 April 2014.

Provision was made in section 15 to enable the reassignment of an SPSV licence in the event of the death of the licenceholder. Under the law, a licenceholder can formally nominate someone to take over the licence when the holder dies. The Act sets out rules governing the process. The provision applies to all categories of SPSV, including taxi, hackneys, limousines, wheelchair-accessible taxis and wheelchair-accessible hackneys. This process relates to the licence for the vehicle to be used as a public vehicle. Obviously, in the interests of public safety and consumer protection, the vehicle is still required to meet the normal safety standards set for SPSVs and the new driver must meet the requirements for an SPSV driver licence.

The NTA is the independent regulator and administers the process for these formal nominations and reassignments of vehicle licences. The NTA website has details about the process and the relevant forms. The nomination form and an information guide can be collected in hard copy at all NTA inspection centres or when requested through the industry information line.

The industry is regularly requested to complete this free nomination process through the SPSV industry updates newsletter. I am told that these forms are also handed to licenceholders or their representatives after every annual vehicle inspection. The NTA has informed me that it urges all SPSV licenceholders to submit a completed nomination form.

I am aware that there have been cases where licenceholders have passed away without completing this form. I am asking the NTA to consider raising the level of awareness of the nomination process. I strongly support the NTA in encouraging SPSV licenceholders to complete the nomination form and I advise all SPSV licenceholders to take the time to complete this form as soon as possible.

We have a really difficult situation here, which obviously is not unique. However, we also have a situation whereby it would be extraordinarily difficult to retrospectively anticipate the wishes of anyone in this predicament.

Photo of Gerald NashGerald Nash (Labour)
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I thank the Minister for his response and I thank you, a Leas-Chathaoirligh, for indulging me in permitting me to mention the two particular cases, with one of which I am especially familiar. I did so merely to illustrate the point and the human cost of this overly bureaucratic system and its impact on people on a regular basis. I tend not to mention individual cases in this House and I understand the restrictions that ought to apply, but I took the view it was important to illustrate the point that I was trying to make, that is to say, that there was a human cost to this.

I have looked at the form on the website. It appears tenth on a list of obscure forms on the website. It seems to me that the existence of this form is not widely understood in the taxi sector. I have spoken to many smart people who work in the taxi sector in recent days to assess their level of knowledge. The level of knowledge is extremely poor. In cases like this families are put in difficult situations. There appears to be no flexibility whatsoever and no humane and compassionate understanding of the circumstances in which people find themselves when someone dies suddenly.

Every year, taxi drivers are required to renew the licence. It would be worthwhile if the regulator would consider informing individuals on an annual basis of their obligation to sign these forms if they wish to reassign their licences for consideration to family members in the event of their passing.

I appeal to the Minister to take a personal interest in this matter and to work with the regulator of taxis to try to have this resolved. I am committed to doing that. I believe we need a far more humane and compassionate system to try to work with women like Marie Keegan and Mrs. Lee, who lost her husband recently, to address these real and human problems. I appeal to the Minister to commit to doing that.

Photo of Shane RossShane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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The fact the Senator has pointed out that this is not a unique case indicates there is certainly a problem. This may be a problem with communication. I have pointed out the ways the NTA is communicating the need or obligation on anyone in this situation to fill out the form and nominate someone. If they do not, then the licence dies with them.

It seems to be something I cannot retrospectively change but we can certainly make stringent efforts and ensure that State agencies and others insist that communication is better. Perhaps the suggestion that taxi drivers or drivers of SPSVs should be informed and reminded of this every year is a good one.

I do not know the details in the particular instance and we cannot anticipate such cases but it certainly seems that there is a recurring problem, if the Senator is right. I urge the NTA to address it by communicating more frequently with those who hold these licences.