Dáil debates
Wednesday, 12 November 2025
Ceisteanna - Questions
Cabinet Committees
4:25 am
Aisling Dempsey (Meath West, Fianna Fail)
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18. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [46880/25]
Paul McAuliffe (Dublin North-West, Fianna Fail)
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19. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [46881/25]
Catherine Ardagh (Dublin South Central, Fianna Fail)
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20. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [46848/25]
Martin Daly (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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21. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [46853/25]
Ruth Coppinger (Dublin West, Solidarity)
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22. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [52040/25]
Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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23. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [53072/25]
Peadar Tóibín (Meath West, Aontú)
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24. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [56964/25]
Mark Ward (Dublin Mid West, Sinn Fein)
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25. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [56980/25]
Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, Solidarity)
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26. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [56995/25]
Ruth Coppinger (Dublin West, Solidarity)
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27. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [57001/25]
Ruairí Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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28. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [57036/25]
Barry Heneghan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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29. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [57153/25]
Conor McGuinness (Waterford, Sinn Fein)
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30. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [58033/25]
Liam Quaide (Cork East, Social Democrats)
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31. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [58230/25]
Barry Heneghan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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32. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will meet next. [59584/25]
Rose Conway-Walsh (Mayo, Sinn Fein)
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33. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [59734/25]
Cian O'Callaghan (Dublin Bay North, Social Democrats)
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34. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [60924/25]
James Geoghegan (Dublin Bay South, Fine Gael)
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35. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet [61553/25]
Richard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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36. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on disability will next meet. [61676/25]
John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
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I remind Members that we are due to conclude at 4.18 p.m.
Micheál Martin (Cork South-Central, Fianna Fail)
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I propose to take questions Nos. 18 to 36, inclusive, together.
The Cabinet committee on disability has been established to oversee the implementation of the programme for Government commitments in the area of disability, with specific focus on children's disability services as well as disability more generally under the Government's new National Human Rights Strategy for Disabled People 2025-2030.
Under the programme for Government, we are committed to delivering a step change in disability services and to advancing the rights and improving the lives of people with disabilities. To deliver on this, I established the stand-alone Cabinet committee on disability. This committee has met five times to date, most recently on 16 October, and it is due to meet again on 27 November. To date, the committee has considered issues including the new national disability strategy, the provision of therapists in special schools, improving the delivery of services and reform of the assessment of need process.
Despite the committed efforts of so many working to provide services and significant increases in funding and resources in recent years, I acknowledge that we can and must do more and do better. I am determined that this will be a Government that moves forward with purpose in improving the level, scale and quality of support for disabled people and their families.
The Government's new National Human Rights Strategy for Disabled People 2025-2030, published in September, is the framework for our whole-of-government approach to addressing disability and advancing the implementation of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities. It represents our commitment and ambition that all disabled people in Ireland can live the life of their choosing and participate in their communities and our society to the fullest extent possible.
In budget 2026, we took initial steps to deliver on this commitment through record allocations for disabilities services and special education. Reflecting the importance of disability issues, I have established a dedicated disability unit in my Department.
An initial programme planned for the unit has been published, outlining how the unit will work to achieve this. The unit is already up and running, supporting the work of the Cabinet committee on disability and ensuring a truly all-of-government approach to disability.
4:35 am
Aisling Dempsey (Meath West, Fianna Fail)
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I want to raise the urgent issue of the transition from child disability services to adult disability services. A constituent has told me that her child was not seen by child disability services until he was almost 18 and that was eight years post her first contact. The family had no clarity on what supports they were entitled to when he was a child, let alone what they were facing into from adult disability services. Another constituent - another mother - has told me some therapies her child receives now are not going to be available in adult disability services. Somehow, her adult child will not have the same needs any more. In this case, respite will also be withdrawn when her child ages out of child disability services. This is leaving families feeling anxious, unsupported and fearful for their family's future. Will the Taoiseach and the committee urgently examine the transition process between child and adult disability services to ensure continuity of care and no loss of essential supports for young people and their families?
Catherine Ardagh (Dublin South Central, Fianna Fail)
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One of the greatest fears facing parents of children with disabilities and parents of adult children with disabilities is what will happen when we are no longer here. Who will care for my son? Who will care for all of these children, including adult children? It is a question that causes sleepless nights for so many people. Ultimately, we need a clear, compassionate pathway for lifelong housing and care in the community for adults with disabilities, so families can have certainty and peace of mind.
Will the Government commit to developing a national plan to ensure that every person with a disability has a safe, permanent home and the supports they need, not just for today but for the future? All of us have been in many houses in our constituencies and we have met elderly parents caring for middle-aged children with disabilities. It is heartbreaking that they are in their senior years and they do not know what is going to happen to their son or daughter when they pass. We have all dealt with these types of queries. It is something that lies ahead for me and my family also. We need to start discussing housing and care in the community for people with disabilities.
Martin Daly (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I am following on from what my colleague Deputies have already said about the care of the offspring of people who are getting older and have no certainty around what is going to happen when they are not here any more. It is a major challenge within the community. It seems like a cliff edge. When you die, you get a residency. That is not good enough. There has got to be planning around that, and it should be seamless.
A lot of work has been done on the provision of special education classes, and special school place provision. We have done stuff around increasing the income disregard for the carer's allowance and we are getting to an abolishment of the means test but also I think we need to address flexible arrangements around getting more people who live with disability into work and out of poverty without losing their benefits. The cost of disability payment should be considered also. There is a lot of work to be done. The direction is right but we do need a huge focus on it.
Peadar Tóibín (Meath West, Aontú)
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It is 420 days since I asked the Tánaiste, Deputy Simon Harris, about why Harvey Morrison Sherratt was taken off the waiting list. The Tánaiste has not been able to answer that question in those 420 days. That is an incredible indictment in relation to it. He said in the Dáil that he would immediately ask the HSE and that he would ask the Minister for Health, yet no question has been answered.
We saw in The Sunday Times this weekend that a protected disclosure was submitted to the Department of Health. The information in this protected disclosure is catastrophic. The implication is that someone, or a group, took a decision that was not medically based and may have led to the death of Harvey. That is a catastrophic question. The import of that on a government is absolutely enormous. What the Government is asking us to believe is that on one level, the Tánaiste has spent 420 days asking questions in relation to why Harvey was taken off the waiting list and he still did not get an answer and, at the same time, a protected disclosure was given to the Department of Health with the answer. That is an incredible thing.
Does the Government understand the import of what has just happened? Why has it taken 420 days for the Tánaiste to answer a question? Have the staff or the management involved actually been asked what has happened?
John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Deputy.
Peadar Tóibín (Meath West, Aontú)
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Are they refusing to answer what has happened? Why is it that the family only found out through The Sunday Times what happened in relation to their child?
John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
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I am sorry that I overlooked Deputy Coppinger.
Ruth Coppinger (Dublin West, Solidarity)
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That is no problem.
Governments have fallen over less than what has happened in relation to Harvey Morrison Sherratt. We found out over the weekend through a protected disclosure that a worker heard or became aware that Harvey had been taken off the waiting list because he was mistakenly, or for whatever reason, considered "palliative" - in itself a horrible phrase. First, his parents were not told and, second, no care plan or treatment plan was drawn up if he was "palliative". This just defies belief. Aside from the fact that he may have ended up dying because of this error, perhaps if he had received the surgery, he would not be dead. The fact is that we have surgeons who would not tell parents about this and who would not organise a care plan for a "palliative" child. Every week, we come in here and ask the Taoiseach to have a statutory public inquiry. The Government's stance has been to have a scoping inquiry here and a scoping inquiry there. We need a full statutory inquiry into all of the issues surrounding Harvey, CHI and spinal surgery. The Taoiseach should have asked questions since this broke on Sunday, given how important this issue is in Ireland for so many people.
John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Deputy.
Ruth Coppinger (Dublin West, Solidarity)
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He should have asked CHI directly about this particular issue, so I hope he has answers for us today.
Mark Ward (Dublin Mid West, Sinn Fein)
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I was at a public meeting last Monday in Neilstown hosted by parents of children with disabilities. They raised a multitude of areas and how their children are being failed. There are long waiting lists for assessment of need, speech and language therapy and occupational therapy. There is no access to appropriate school places. There are limited SNA allocations. They also talked about not even getting appropriate places for school transport and arbitrary timeframes for filling out forms. If they do not fill out the forms within the timeframe, there are consequences for their children.
I got a response this morning saying the average wait time for an assessment of need in my area of Dublin Mid-West is three and a half years, even though the statutory timeframe is six months. Children are being denied the right to reach their full potential. How is the Government going to address the failures children are experiencing?
Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, Solidarity)
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The budget reneged on a key commitment in the programme for Government to introduce a permanent annual cost of disability support payment and then to incrementally increase it. We know that it costs a lot of money to be disabled in this country. A few years ago, the Department of Finance estimated it at around €10,000. It has obviously gone up substantially since then. Last year's €400 lump sum disability payment was a drop in the ocean but far from increasing it, as promised, the Government abolished it completely. It slashed other payments that disabled people rely on, like the living alone allowance lump sum and the electricity credit. Even taking into account small increases to the disability allowance, the Government still took well over €1,000 out of the pockets of disabled people. It is shocking in one of the richest countries in the world, with a budget surplus and with the cost-of-living crisis ongoing, that the Government made disabled people poor. That is not just in real inflationary terms but even in nominal terms.
John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Deputy.
Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, Solidarity)
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The Government made them poorer, and took over €1,000 from them. Will it recognise this as a major mistake? Will it bring back an emergency lump sum cost-of-living payment for disabled people before Christmas?
Ruairí Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I want to bring up the attempt by Darver National School in County Louth to have two autism classes sanctioned. The initial engagement between the principal, the SENO and the NCSE took place in June 2025. This was followed up throughout September and October, with no word back. It is absolutely supported by the patrons and the board of management and all have tried to make contact. We need to ensure that this happens but we also need to ensure that the school is contacted.
I do not think this is okay. I am just giving the timeframe on this.
I also need someone to light a fire under the Department of education in relation to Ardee Educate Together National School. Louth County Council is the agent but the Department -----
4:45 am
John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
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Thank you Deputy.
Ruairí Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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This relates to parking spaces and planning. It should be a very small piece of work to get this changed to account for the 45 staff and also enough bays for the minibuses. At this point, there is not space. It would be very cheap to get it changed at this point. A contractor is on for this. If not at this point, then we could be talking about something that could cost €100,000-plus.
Barry Heneghan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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Is there an update or timeline from the Cabinet committee on disability on assessments of need?
In my own constituency, Stapolin Educate Together primary school is looking for two additional autism classes. It has a very powerful image of 12 chairs outside that school representing children locked out. I would urge the Taoiseach push-----
Micheál Martin (Cork South-Central, Fianna Fail)
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Which school?
Barry Heneghan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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Stapolin in Dublin Bay North. I can send details to the Taoiseach’s office. These children are locked out. I urge that the NCSE look at this school. It has brilliant staff who are really hard working.
Gabhaim míle buíochas leis an Aire, Deputy McEntee, i dtaobh Ghaelcholáiste Reachrann. Tá sé iontach go bhfuil rudaí ag bogadh ar aghaidh air sin.
Conor McGuinness (Waterford, Sinn Fein)
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The Government is failing children in Waterford with additional needs over the stagnation in early intervention classes. Five years ago, there were two early intervention classes across Waterford city and county. This year, there are still two. That is despite an increasing need and a demand that is there but unmet. These early interventions are critical for children’s educational and social outcomes. It is something that the Taoiseach’s Government needs to grapple with. Over the last nine or ten months, we have seen issues around special education spaces and classes in schools. While the Government did belatedly do some work to fill some of those gaps in service provision, there is a lot more to do. That situation is still there and I think there will be problems next year. We need to get to grips with the early intervention classes and increase them dramatically so that there is availability for parents to get their children that much-needed timely intervention.
Liam Quaide (Cork East, Social Democrats)
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The plight of ageing parents of adult children with intellectual disabilities is an area of abject neglect on the part of the Government. Many of these parents are being deprived of peace of mind in their later years because they remain the primary carers of their children. They are less physically able to carry out this role as time goes on. They are living with a constant background worry of not knowing where their children will live after they die and how their need for belonging and community will be met.
The Government’s privatisation of services means that both young people and adults who require 24-hour staffed residential support are increasingly living far from home, in some cases hundreds of kilometres away, not connected to wrap-around services, detached from their communities and families. What is the Taoiseach’s plan to address this particular crisis in residential services for people with intellectual disabilities? Why are these services being privatised and fragmented to such an extent when the outcomes in many cases are so poor for our disabled citizens and when the cost to the State is so enormous?
Rose Conway-Walsh (Mayo, Sinn Fein)
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It is an absolute disgrace that even today we still do not know which children were wrongly removed from the scoliosis waiting list or why it happened. Families have been left in the dark while children suffer in pain. There is a clear culture of secrecy, concealment and unaccountability at the heart of children’s healthcare and an utter lack of transparency. I want to talk to the Taoiseach again, after many other times I have done so, about Mikey Henry Benson from Mayo, who is still waiting for the procedures he needs. I want to ask the Taoiseach to ask the Minister for Health when she is in Mayo on Monday to meet the family of Mikey Henry Benson to go through the episodes and the pain they have gone through and to find a way forward so that we can ensure that Mikey Henry Benson stays alive?
Cian O'Callaghan (Dublin Bay North, Social Democrats)
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The Government has said time and again that there should be an appropriate school place for every child. I am contacted constantly by parents who are desperately trying to get a place for their child in an autism class. The same as any other parent, they just want their child to be able to thrive. Stapolin Educate Together National School in Baldoyle has asked to open two additional new autism classes. The school has the space for the modular units required. It also has experienced staff who can support the opening of these two additional classes. All that is required is for approval to be granted. Is the Minister for education going to meet the school principal about this and when is approval going be granted for these two much-needed classes?
Richard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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While I was getting my treatment in St. Luke's, I met a very nice woman called Shirley who brought up her daughter Lauren's case with me. Lauren subsequently wrote to me. Lauren lives with her and has a life-long disability condition that means she is unfit for work. She had previously been on domiciliary care allowance, then on disability allowance, but she then got married. She lives at home with her mum still, being cared for by her mum, but because she got married and went over the threshold, her disability payment has been cut. It really highlights the massive problem and injustice of having means testing of disability payments. What does the Taoiseach have to say to Lauren and many others like her who lose all support for their disability on the basis that their partner’s income has gone over a very arbitrary threshold?
John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
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We are gone way over time, so I would ask the Taoiseach to consider that.
Micheál Martin (Cork South-Central, Fianna Fail)
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We are about seven minutes over time, is it?
John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
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Yes.
Micheál Martin (Cork South-Central, Fianna Fail)
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I will try to do what I can as quickly as I can.
John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
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No, you are okay. Just -----
Micheál Martin (Cork South-Central, Fianna Fail)
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No, I am conscious of others.
Deputy Dempsey raised the issue of transition from child services to adult services and that there was an absence of early planning for that. She also made the comment that parents were told that therapies would not be available in transition. That is not acceptable and respite should not be withdrawn. In the disability unit that I have established, a key workstream will be planning and designing for the future. There should be proper data and proper early analysis of expected need for services from primary to post-primary, from post-primary to adult or, indeed, continuing education or other aspects. That is where I want to get to and that is where we want to get to as a Government because there is no doubt - Deputy Ardagh has raised this as well, as have others - that the insecurity is shocking. It is very sad that so many parents – I have met them – have no certainty. Deputy Daly said it was a cliff edge, and it is for many. If one talks to some of the providers in the sections 38 and 39 organisations, they are all dealing with emergency cases. That is not satisfactory, so we have got to get a more planned approach to this transition. I think there are also issues in terms of the interaction between the sections 38 and 39 organisations and the Government and Government services and how that works. Many of those are under pressure as well, I have to acknowledge, but equally we have to work out the models and so forth. There should be proper databases outlining how many people are in a given service at a given time and what will the requirements be at a later date. There is that issue of creating a secure transition and that older parents in particular, senior citizens now, have a certain sense of security and knowledge well in advance that their children will be looked after in case anything happens to themselves. That is a very understandable human concern, which is not being met at the moment but that needs to be met. I am very determined that we would put services in place to enable that to happen. There is a fear there, as Deputy Ardagh said. She called for a national plan for this and that is something I am going to work on so that people will have that security. Other Deputies have raised that issue. We should be looking at a seamless transition, ideally.
There is a link into housing as well in that respect, different solutions at different times in the journey of life that people can move to better accommodation, more suitable accommodation. We should have greater flexibility around that provision. There can be too many silos between different Government Departments in respect of that but we are working on it. That is what the Cabinet subcommittee is for, to do a cross-government, whole-of-government approach.
Deputy Daly and others raised the income disregard and the cost of disability. The cost of disability will be looked at in the next budget and there is a working group established in relation to that. On the relationship between work and disability payments, there are some supports there for transitioning from disability, from the social protection system, into work in terms of the medical card and others. I think that can be strengthened and that those moving into work can be given greater certainty, more long-term certainty, that they will retain their benefits or whatever entitlements they have as they go into work. There have been improvements on the employer grant and so on but there is further work to be done in terms of giving greater security around that transition and encouraging people to go into work without fear of losing their health entitlements or the various other entitlements they have.
Earlier during Leaders' Questions, we dealt with questions in respect of Harvey Morrison Sherratt. I would say to the Deputy the Minister is this afternoon meeting with the parents. The Minister did look for a chronology from the HSE. The Minister has that. The CEO of the HSE shared that with the family. It is a draft because the HSE wanted the family's input into that. I dealt with the protected disclosure earlier on Leaders' Questions. The Minister did not see that. All protected disclosures do not go to the Ministers per se. The Minister has an obligation to establish a system by which it goes to the protected disclosure commissioner. That commissioner has the specific protected disclosure and is now going to deal with that. Without question, there is a meeting on between the Minister, the Tánaiste and the parents of Harvey, with a view to an inquiry. The precise format is to be determined.
Deputy Coppinger had a similar question in relation to this. It is a fundamental question as to why Harvey was taken off a waiting list. There are clinical decisions clearly involved here that have to be examined and will be examined. Likewise, there are other, broader investigations and examinations of issues pertaining to CHI, as the Deputy knows. Some of them have come in and some have not. Overall, again, terms of reference have to be specific here. We can have statutory inquiries that can go on too long and do not give closure to families. I think there is a bit of work to be done yet and the Minister is meeting with the family in that regard.
Deputy Murphy raised the issue of the cost of disability programme. I dealt with that earlier insofar as the next budget will be dealing with that. Once-off payments were two years. What we were determined to do in this budget was to increase the permanent payments within the social protection system, which we did, for example, and to enhance them as well and also, in terms of the carer's allowance threshold and income disregard, to increase that and we will eliminate that over the lifetime of this Government. We increased the domiciliary care allowance significantly.
In terms of education, there are now about 46,500 teachers and SNAs working in our education system, committed to supporting and nurturing children with special educational needs. Huge numbers of special needs assistants have been appointed over the past number of years. There are about 400 new special classes in the budget of 2025, and about 2,700 new places for the 2025-2026 school year. Some of those school places are under construction and being put in place. A number of specifics have been asked. I will check those out with the Minister. I am not in a position to have knowledge of every single application from individual schools in respect of autism classes and so forth but I will follow those up with the Minister. I presume the Deputies are also engaging with the Departments in respect of that.
On the assessment of need, the Cabinet subcommittee on disability did approve outline proposals for a change in legislation which will have to happen to prioritise the provision of services. Therapy services to children has been the number one priority in terms of the legislative objective of that. The access and inclusion model, AIM, is a critical intervention for early years in terms of disability, in response to Deputy McGuinness's question. I would make that point and that has been enhanced and improved and will be improved as a result of the recent budget. Deputies Quaide, Dempsey and Ardagh raised the issue of insecurity and worry for ageing parents of children with disabilities. I am very conscious of that and we will work to see if we can improve on that.
I have dealt with the issue raised by Deputy Conway-Walsh. I response to Deputy Cian O'Callaghan, I will check in respect of the school in Baldoyle. I do not have awareness of that. In response to Deputy Boyd Barrett, again, I do not know the specific issue but I think it is an income threshold issue in terms of people marrying.
4:55 am
Richard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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It is, yes, the means test.
Micheál Martin (Cork South-Central, Fianna Fail)
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I will have that examined. That is something that we can certainly look at. I will talk to the Minister for Social Protection in relation to that.
Rose Conway-Walsh (Mayo, Sinn Fein)
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Sorry, I think the Taoiseach was referring to the previous question. It was the one on Mikey Henry-Benson I had asked.
Micheál Martin (Cork South-Central, Fianna Fail)
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Sorry. Again, I will talk to the Minister in respect of it. To be fair, this should be done at hospital level. It should be done properly through the clinicians properly engaging with the family and with the parents. There are liaison officers in CHI as well who should be-----
Rose Conway-Walsh (Mayo, Sinn Fein)
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I know it should but it was not and it is not.
Micheál Martin (Cork South-Central, Fianna Fail)
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I will make the Minister aware of the case.
Rose Conway-Walsh (Mayo, Sinn Fein)
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Thank you.
Ruairí Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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On the two issues, if I could write to the Taoiseach and if his good offices would be able to put some pressure on-----
Micheál Martin (Cork South-Central, Fianna Fail)
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There are about ten projects now that you have all mentioned. I am good but-----
Ruairí Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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In fairness these are critical time-wise.