Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees
Wednesday, 27 May 2026
Joint Oireachtas Committee on Agriculture and Food
Cattle Kill Reduction and Cattle Prices: Meat Industry Ireland
2:00 am
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Apologies have been received from Deputy Michael Fitzmaurice. He will be substituted by Deputy Michael Collins. Tá fáilte romhat.
I wish draw to the attention of the witnesses that giving evidence from within the parliamentary precinct, they are protected by absolute privilege in respect of the evidence they give to the committee. This means that a witness has a full defence in any defamation action for anything said at a committee meeting. However, witnesses are expected not to abuse this privilege and may be directed to cease giving evidence on the issue at the Chair's direction. Witnesses should follow the direction of the Chair in this regard and are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that, as is reasonable, no adverse commentary should be made against an identifiable third person or entity. Witnesses who are to give evidence from a location outside the parliamentary precincts are asked to note that they may not benefit from the same level of immunity from legal proceedings as a witness giving evidence from within the parliamentary precincts and may consider it appropriate to take legal advice on this matter. Privilege against defamation does not apply to the publication by witnesses outside of the proceedings held by the committee of any matters arising from the proceedings.
Members are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that members should not comment on, criticise or make charges against a person outside the House or an official, either by name or in such a way as to make him or her identifiable. Parliamentary privilege is considered to apply to the utterances of members participating online in a committee meeting when their participation is from within the parliamentary precincts. Members may not participate online in a public meeting from outside the parliamentary precincts and any attempt to do so will result in the member having their online access removed. Everybody participating is present in the room. There is no member online at the moment.
The agenda for today's meeting is to examine the cattle kill reduction and cattle prices. Members are going to hear from Meat Industry Ireland. Cuirim fáilte roimh Mr. Philip Carroll, chairman, Mr. Dale Crammond, director, and Ms Síle Sweeney, senior executive. Your opening statements have been circulated and I will give five minutes to go through the opening statement on it. Members particularly wanted this issue on the agenda because a lot of concern has been raised from farmers who have had a range of different difficulties, including the price they are getting in the factory, difficulties booking in cattle and still seeing the numbers of cattle going through reducing. It is really a concern for farmers. They are experiencing an increase in their overheads, whether it is for diesel or manure or a range of different issues. To see a drop in the price even though there seems to be capacity in the factory is very much a concern for farmers. We want to try to get an understanding of where things are going there and how we can make sure it is possible to get the best possible price for farmers on it.
Mr. Philip Carroll:
I thank the Chair and committee members for the opportunity to speak today about processing throughput and cattle prices in the beef industry. I am the chairman of Meat Industry Ireland, MII. I am joined today by Mr. Dale Crammond, director and by Síle Sweeney, senior executive. MII members operate 28 processing sites nationwide, directly employ more than 12,000 people and support many thousands more jobs across the rural economy.
At the outset it is important to recognise the vital role farmers play in supplying the high-quality raw material that underpins our international success. They deserve to be fully rewarded for that contribution and this was reflected in the historically strong cattle prices seen in recent years, especially in 2025. The falling cattle prices in the early part of this year is a disappointment to the sector, and to farmers in particular, following a period of strong growth. Our members are acutely aware of the challenges this creates at a time when the food and drink sectors face multiple geopolitical economic pressures. We have engaged with the sector to share our perspective and will continue with that dialogue.
The Irish beef sector is export-led with 90% of production sold in international markets. Last year, exports exceeded €3.5 billion, up 23% on 2024 even though volumes were 40,000 tonnes below the average of the past decade. This increase was driven by short-term inflationary market conditions. In the UK market, exports rose in value by 25% to €1.6 billion, representing 40% of total market value despite a decline in UK beef imports. As retail prices continued to rise during 2025 it became evident that demand was being affected with volumes down 7.2% towards the end of the year. High prices effectively stalled beef demand across retail and food services. Meanwhile, imported beef from Australia, New Zealand, Poland and Brazil gained market share. Exports to EU markets rose by 28%, generating a further €1.6 billion in 2025. Demand was strongest for forequarter mince and manufacturing beef, while higher-value primal cuts declined as the price gap between beef and other meats such as pork and poultry became more evident. Exports to other international markets fell to €135 million as buyers focused on sourcing closer to home. This reflected a widening gap on price between Ireland and the EU compared with international suppliers.
These export trends underlined an important point that any discussion of domestic cattle prices or kill numbers must be grounded in global market conditions, consumer purchasing power and structural change within the national herd. Last year cattle throughput fell by over 200,000 head. According to the latest Department of agriculture and Central Statistics Office, CSO, figures the beef kill in the first quarter of 2026 was some 72,000 head lower than in the same period in 2025. That is a contraction of 18.7%. The main factors driving the current supply-side vacuum are the lag effects of live exports and nitrates constraints. In 2023 and 2024 Ireland saw record live cattle and weanling exports exceeding 300,000 head annually. Those animals are now being processed in the Netherlands, Spain and Italy rather than in Irish plants. Dairy bred animals now account for over 60% of the total beef kill. However, the nitrates derogation and implementation of dairy banding have forced many farmers to reduce stock numbers or exit beef finishing entirely in order to remain compliant with nitrates. Alongside the decline of the suckler herd this has effectively placed a hard cap on cattle availability in 2026. We are conscious that winter finishing challenges were more acute this year when finishers were caught in a market correction that moved faster and further than anybody in the supply chain could have anticipated, including processors. Farmers made decisions in the autumn based on market signals that looked reasonable at the time. High input costs, with concentrate feed still 25% above the five-year average, discouraged many producers from winter finishing.
Without price certainty to cover meal and energy costs, the spring supply gap coincided with weaker demand in the UK and the EU, putting further pressure on price.
Irish cattle prices reached historic highs in 2025, driven by genuine supply tightness and strong international retailer demand. The resulting price increases affected demand and made Europe and the UK targets for third-country imports. Competitiveness in our primary markets is now under severe threat from a perfect storm of international factors. The UK market has shifted. Historically, Ireland provided nearly 80% of UK beef imports. Following the UK-Australia and UK-New Zealand free trade agreements, and growth in Polish and Brazilian imports, Ireland's market share fell to 67% in 2025. Australian beef imports into the UK have surged by over 400%, offering a significantly lower-cost alternative to Irish grass-fed beef. There is little scope for us to price ourselves out of this market, nor can we diversify to greener fields where none exist. As a result, our industry is facing a carcase imbalance driven by consumer behaviour. The latest Kantar figures from April show we are experiencing a volume decline in beef steaks and joints by 37% and 70%, respectively, as consumers trade down to cheaper proteins, such as poultry, pork or lower-value manufacturing beef. When prime cuts, which account for 30% of the animal, fail to achieve a premium price, the value of the whole carcase falls. In this market, processors are price-takers competing against lower-cost international suppliers.
Beef processing is a high-volume, low-margin business. When throughput drops by 19%, fixed costs per unit, including labour, energy, refrigeration, transport and regulatory compliance, increase sharply. Running a plant at 80% capacity is significantly less efficient than running at 100%. Despite these pressures, the prime Irish composite beef price closely tracks the export benchmark price. This demonstrates that Irish cattle prices are on a par with our European competitors despite the additional cost of exporting 90% of our beef output.
The 2025-26 cattle supply reduction is a structural reality rooted in dairy sector changes and previous export trends. Cattle prices, while lower than last year's historic anomalies, remain high by long-term standards but are under intense pressure from shifts in consumer spending and aggressive new trade competition. MII remains committed to the long-term viability of Irish beef farming. We recognise the value of farmers' work and the pressure they face when market prices fall and costs remain high. The beef sector is not unique in this regard. Similar challenges have recently affected the dairy and tillage sectors. The strong returns paid to farmers in recent years reflect the sector's dependence on their continued commitment. We aim to remain competitive within the UK and EU markets. We must continue working together to ensure the Irish beef brand remains both premium and competitive in an increasingly crowded global market. I thank the committee. We are happy to take any questions.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Mr. Carroll for his comprehensive opening statement. It is a beautiful, sunny day, and I know members would like to be out in it, but they are here to question the witnesses because they are very concerned about farmers' concerns about the beef price. Members made it their business to be here on the sunniest day of the year. I thank them for taking part.
We will do seven-minute slots per member. We will open with Deputy Aird.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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We can start with Deputy Collins
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Does the Deputy want to give over his time?
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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Just the first slot. Deputy Collins has to go to another meeting.
Michael Collins (Cork South-West, Independent Ireland Party)
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I thank Deputy Aird and the Chairman, and I welcome the witnesses. I have a few brief questions. In light of less tonnage of beef being exported and a record monetary value for the tonnage exported, why are farmers being hit with €1.20 less per kilo for cattle slaughtered?
Michael Collins (Cork South-West, Independent Ireland Party)
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Yes.
Michael Collins (Cork South-West, Independent Ireland Party)
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Yes, please, if Mr. Carroll does not mind.
Mr. Philip Carroll:
They have to some extent. I have heard a lot about it and have spoken to the farm organisations around this particular issue. When we talk to members, they tell us that while there are delays, they are not lengthy and they do not arise in all processing plants. The problem was a little more difficult four to five weeks ago but it has been ameliorated quite considerably. In large part, the issue we face in the sector is one where the supply chain is not functioning. What is happening is what always happens and is always the case in a regular market scenario when a market is relatively stable. We have sufficient capacity. As I indicated earlier, we are working at about 80% capacity at the moment. We would normally be working in the first quarter of the year at full capacity. We can cope with that in all circumstances except when the market is not functioning. That is what is happening at the moment. There is no cold store in the country that has capacity for processed product. I had that fully verified yesterday and again this morning. What you do when you are processing is to process to contracts. The contracts are not there at the moment at the level they would normally be expected to be because our output going into the UK has dropped by 10%. That is the problem we are facing at the moment. We expect that position to work its way through the system over the next short while. We also know that production is likely to scale back for the next short while. We hope that balance will be there. However, I do not think the problem is as great or as comprehensive across the country as has been suggested.
Michael Collins (Cork South-West, Independent Ireland Party)
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I thank Mr. Carroll. Why are EU cattle prices €1 per kilogram ahead of what Ireland is paid?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
We always face a challenge exporting into these markets. We are the number one exporter into many of the markets, including the UK. There will always be a premium for UK beef produced in the UK market under the Red Tractor brand so our objective is to try to maintain that position as the number one importer. We still very much are in that space. However, as Mr. Carroll said, we are coming under more pressure from imports, particularly from the likes of Australia, imports from which have soared by over 400%. It now has an unrestricted quota of approximately 30,000 tonnes per annum, and that is going to grow over the next 15 years. After 15 years, that trade is going to be fully liberalised. We have long-term challenges exporting into the UK market.
If you look at the price tracker across the board, we are running approximately 20 cent behind EU prices at the moment in the prime composite price versus the export benchmark price. That is where it should be. The price does not include the cost of transport for getting that product to the European markets. There should be a deficit there in terms of the price we are achieving. Last year, we ran ahead of the EU price and that was solely down to a bit of concern in the marketplace around supply. There was a lot of concern that there were going to be cattle constraints in Australia, the US and other markets. There probably was a bit of panic buying last year and we benefited from that. Because we are the first importer of choice, we were able to reap the benefit.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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I welcome the witnesses. I read the opening statement. Like the Cathaoirleach, I acknowledge that it is a lovely day outside. However, there are very dark clouds over the whole beef industry.
I will open my remarks by sharing some statistics for where we are at the moment. This time last year, bulls were achieving €7.95 per kg. I know of bulls that were killed on Monday for €6.70. Today, the price quoted is €6.40. That particular person and farmer, an ordinary individual, like the witnesses, me or anybody else who is farming, can see what they are losing.
I will share another statistic. Look at cattle bought in during October or November, say at €2,420. When they were sold in March, they went for €20 less at €2,400. Those cattle had to be fed at a cost of €350 a head. That €350 is for nothing other than food. Those farmers are down €350 per head.
What is the traditional family farmer, who we are always talking about, to do? Here is a family farmer who traditionally had a suckler herd. Last year, everyone was in good humour and they got a great price with it. Now we are being told that was a flip. I know people who got bulled heifers back into the game again and were delighted with themselves and they are now back to square one or maybe even in a worse position than they ever were.
Take what is happening now. We have the factories coming in contract rearing where I, as a farmer, can just rear the calves for the farmer and that is the way it is going. Where is family farmer going to be? The old, traditional way is going to die completely because there is so much volatility in the market that no single farmer can carry that burden. We see will see it today.
We talk about being Bord Bia audited. For what? Now look at the market being flooded with Australian beef, Brazilian beef and everything. None of them are audited. We are audited here, producing the best beef and now we are getting a slap in the face with our beef losing €350 and €400 a head. I want the people to understand the pressure that is out there at the moment and the human mental pressure this is causing people. I want to ask a few questions but I am giving that from the heart, speaking on behalf of people I have spoken to who are at their wits' end for the last three weeks. These are young farmers we are encouraging into farming. They are in such a volatile market that the witnesses cannot tell me where we will be this time next year. Nobody can tell us. Nobody could tell us that beef would be at the price it is today. I had a quotation at €6.40 and going down. If I asked where it was going to stop, the witnesses will not be able to tell me. Nobody would be able to. That is the market we are living in and that is the way these people are being asked to farm.
I want to ask a couple of question. If cattle prices are historically strong, can the witnesses specify clearly what proportion of the retail beef price is actually returning to the primary producer, the farmer, versus retained, processing and retail margins? Can I have a quick answer to that because I do not have much time?
Mr. Philip Carroll:
I do not have a calculation for that figure. However, let me come back to where Deputy Aird started and I will try to work my way around to answering that question. The Deputy has given us exactly what our assessment is of where we see this market. He has talked about volatility. Volatility is acutely extreme at the moment in this short period of one year. It has gone from a situation where at the end of 2024, which the Deputy will remember from the farming-----
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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I am sorry but I have to ask the second question.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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I cannot waste my time. I will be honest. I have three minutes left and I know exactly what Mr. Carroll is going to say to me.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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Mr. Carroll can see what has happened because they are bringing it in without it being Bord Bia audited. They do not have to do that.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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I apologise. I want to ask the next question.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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No, I am sorry but I do not want the answer from that.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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I will give Deputy Aird-----
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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Is the Chair going to give me extra time?
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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I will give Deputy Aird extra time to give Mr. Carroll a chance to answer.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Chair because I have ten questions to ask here today. Be fair to me. I have ten serious questions to ask on behalf of the people out there.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
I am happy to step in. If you look at the work the Agri-Food Regulator has done over recent times, we have had very significant engagement. There is a lot of publicly available information now that shows the selling price of the beef leaving the factory. If you look at what has happened, the hindquarter selling price has declined from about €9.64 last September to about €8.75 today. That is closely matching the fall and the decline in cattle prices over that period. The forequarter is the same, albeit it has not quite declined at the same rate. That is because most of the high-value cuts, as the Deputy knows, are from the hindquarter. We are seeing challenges now in the manufacturing beef market also. Those forequarter prices are going to fall back. That is the evidence that shows the challenges in the marketplace at the moment.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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That is grand. Can I go onto my second question or is the Chair giving me more time? I have the answer to that.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Keep going. Deputy Aird is within time.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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I got that answer. The farmers are losing €350 to €375. How much is the factory losing? That is the answer I will give back. My second question is that given that MII represents 28 processors, how does it respond to repeated farmer concerns that a small number of processors effectively set the price in a highly concentrated market? What is MII's answer to that? Yes or no?
Mr. Philip Carroll:
That was following what was happening in the market. So, the proportion of payback to farmers is represented in those historically high figures. The exact opposite happened at the beginning of this year, where those wholesale prices dropped back quite significantly along the lines of the figures Mr. Crammond mentioned. There was a proportionate response to that in the marketplace. We must bear in mind that every European country, including the UK that is not in the European Union, has seen the same fallback in prices that we have. This is not uniquely Irish. This is European. It is across the globe.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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It is about bringing in beef.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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I want to acknowledge publicly the work the live exporters do in this country and thank them for the work they do. We sent out over 300,000 cattle out of this country this year and I do not have the figure for the calf exports but I can tell you-----
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Use the extra time for questions.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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I was just saying that. Farmers will argue at the moment that the recent price drop was sudden and severe. What specific actions did processors take to avoid passing volatility disproportionately onto the primary producer, namely, the farmer?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
We acknowledge the challenges in the marketplace at the moment. That is very clear. If we look at the sheep price and where it is at, it has continued to go very high. That is in response to market demand. We have the Eid festival at the end of the year. The exact opposite is happening in the beef sector recently. The demand simply is not there. There is beef going into cold storage at the moment. As Mr. Carroll said in his opening statement, we have seen beef steaks and beef joints decline by 37% and 70%. That is really significant to what has happened in the marketplace. The consumer has ultimately pushed back against the high price of beef in Europe and the UK and we are seeing a market correction at the moment. That is the basic reality of what has happened. That is difficult. We understand it is very difficult for finishers at the moment. They obviously had a very good year last year when prices went up very high and it is a very difficult year for them at the moment.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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Would Mr. Crammond take half his salary next year? No, he would not. Does he know what I mean?
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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It is not.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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We are losing €350 this year and Mr. Crammond is telling us we made it last year, which we did not, as it was up around €200 last year. We are, therefore, in a negative situation straight away. My next question is, will MII commit to full, real-time transparency on pricing formulas, contract structures and export returns so farmers can independently verify how prices are set?
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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Yes, is the answer. That is fair enough.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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If 90% of the beef was exported, how does MII justify the claim that Irish cattle prices are fully market effective when Irish farmers have no meaningful domestic price-setting influence?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
We do export 90% of the beef. The Deputy is right. Therefore, we are very reliant on what that market demand is in the international marketplace. It will not be driven by what is happening here domestically. It will be driven by what is happening in the main market. Forty-eight percent of our beef goes to the UK and 48% goes to the EU. We have a very small percentage that goes to third-country markets outside that. By and large, the price of beef and what we get is determined by that marketplace, not how many cattle we kill here domestically and not the other issues Deputy Aird is making reference to. It is the marketplace in Europe and the UK in the main.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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I have five more questions.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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The time Deputy Collins did not use has been consumed now. I call Deputy Kenny.
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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I thank the Chair and I thank the witnesses for their work. I want to acknowledge that 90% of the beef produced in Ireland is exported and that is a huge volume of product we are exporting all over the world, which is bringing huge income into the country and creating a lot of jobs in the country as well. We want to acknowledge that, of course. There are a number of issues around all of this. In 2025, prices went up considerably for the farmer. It also went up for the consumer. We have seen that in the shops as well. Clearly, that is because there was a scarcity.
It was not just scarcity of cattle in Ireland but across Europe and the world. It pushed the price up. When prices go up, demand starts to come down at some point. Have we reached that equilibrium where demand is low and pulling prices back down? Is that what is happening, or has the volume of product from other places started to rise?
Mr. Philip Carroll:
That is where the competitiveness has come into it. It is a new level of competitiveness. The way the Deputy has analysed that is exactly the way the market has moved over that period. One of the key issues with any commodity is that if the price goes up as quickly and as sharply as it did in 2025, there has to be a ceiling. It hit the ceiling probably around July or August last year, when retailers started to adjust their purchasing strategies. That meant there were far fewer promotions of the beef product itself. By not supporting the beef sector, they were piling a cost on the consumer and the consumer reacted to that. From then on, we had high prices and volumes reduced significantly. The level of demand reduced but the price at the retail counter did not reduce. That affordability issue hit very sharply towards the end of the year. We could see trends in that but, coming back to the Deputy's question, we could not anticipate the drop that was going to happen.
The Deputy is also correct that I cannot tell him what a price will be next week or the week after. We do not yet know how long it will take to get that balance back into the market. That balance is very much dependent on what wholesalers and retailers do in the market on the pricing structure, and how that then impacts the consumer. In polls on consumer attitudes, 49% of consumers in Ireland have said that they are buying less beef. In the UK, it is about 45%. The figure is similar - I forget exactly what it is - across European markets. When we look at the French, Dutch, German, Italian and Polish markets in particular, all of those prices have dropped significantly since the beginning of the year, as ours did, too. That is telling us that this is a European and even a global problem. We can trace it back to where we see that, if the Deputy wishes.
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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The problem is that the price is dropping for the farmer but the cost of inputs has remained high and is likely going to remain high. We see the price of fertiliser climbing through the roof. We have a crisis in our suckler sector. I am from a part of the country where there is very little dairy and it is mainly suckler. We produce the weanlings that go to the better parts of the country, are fattened and produce the beef. Farmers have been getting a decent price up to now. That is starting to fall back but the input costs have not fallen and will not be falling.
What is going to be done? We are going to have fewer cattle, as was acknowledged in the opening statement. The volume is going down, yet we have high prices. If the prices start to drop, the volume is going to drop through the floor. That is an issue for everybody in the room, farmers and processors.
Mr. Philip Carroll:
The Deputy touched on the sucklers in that context. Suckler levels have been in decline, probably at a rate of 3% over a considerable number of years, and there has been a 5% reduction over the last few years. The first time that stabilised was 2025. That was directly related to the price, or at least we believe that was the case. Through the Food Vision process, although they have not been finalised yet, we think we have agreed some work streams around the suckler supports that are required to maintain the herd at that level. We do not believe we are going to have a major supply shock on our side. It depends very much on the vulnerability we have in the existing markets. The reality about those markets is that no matter what way we look at it, we are selling a commodity into international markets. We are not the first importer. We probably are the first importer in the UK, but the UK will always favour its own product first. The very same happens in any other country. We have no internal market of substance like other countries. We are always the second importer. For the first time now, because of the volumes coming in from Australia, New Zealand, Brazil, Poland and all the other places I mentioned, we are now more vulnerable to lower cost product coming in. The evidence of that is in the figures we mentioned earlier, the 10% decline. It is difficult but the plus side is that what happens in China and the US also affects those importers into the UK. If those markets opened up a little bit more, importers would concentrate on those markets instead of the European markets. That is probably where we will get the stability back into the market.
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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Meat Industry Ireland represents 28 processors. Many of them also have processing plants in the UK and other countries. An issue that farmers continually bring up is that those plants can be used to control the prices. When prices get high in Ireland, they can source their product from somewhere else to the detriment of the Irish farmer, without whom, because of the volume of beef we produce here, many of the processors would not exist in the first place. Does Mr. Carroll understand that problem? We have a food regulator that looks after the situation in Ireland. Unfortunately, a lot of the companies in Ireland have operations elsewhere that the food regulator has no view over.
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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And as far away as Latin America.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
They are still all processing domestic cattle in the main, in the UK market and the Irish market. They are exposed to the vagaries of the marketplace in the very same way as our processors are here. I do not see the issue there, to be honest. The cattle are being processed domestically. We will continue to try to return the best value to the farmer. It is not in anyone's interest to see beef prices go down the way they have over the last couple of weeks. We got to a stage last year when there was a lot of positivity in the sector. We were engaging with Teagasc and looking at updating some kind of roadmap in terms of profitable suckler beef systems of production. We all want that and we very much value the suckler herd in terms of that quality beef it is putting into the system.
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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How will it compete with the others? How is the suckler herd going to compete with dairy and other sectors? It is really backs to the wall.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
It does compete. Certain markets really demand that product, such as the Italian market in terms of protected geographical indication, PGI, and what we sell into that marketplace. That suckler beef is really valued. We are not in a position to say we prefer one beef over the other. The reality is that 60% of our beef now is coming from the dairy herd and we have to respect that also. It is about marketing all those cattle, sending them to the best markets possible, returning the best price to the farmer, and hoping the public supports can close that gap, as has probably been the case over the last 20 to 30 years.
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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I thank the witnesses for coming in today. We have talked about this in this room before and I have talked about it all my life. Farmers, unfortunately, are price-takers and always have been. For the sake of argument and playing devil's advocate, one could say that the man Deputy Aird talked about gave €350 too much to the store but he gave it in good faith. How can we predict what is happening for the farmer going forward? The processors our witnesses represent have contracts. If I sign any kind of contract in business or whatever, there is a price agreed as well as a tonnage or whatever agreed. When do the goalposts move? If you sign a contract to supply beef to a supermarket, a multinational like Tesco, a different country or whatever, you sign a contract for X amount of tonnage at so much per tonne, kilogram or pound. You get less money next week but you are supplying the same contract. When do the goalposts move? When does that price change? How come we cannot predict it and say that, when the contract runs out, the price is going to be renegotiated? It could be on the Agriland website next week that major contract renegotiation is going to happen at the end of July with China, Japan or whoever and there is potential that beef prices might fluctuate and the farmer would get some kind of forewarning.
I ask the witnesses to clarify something. They have these fixed contracts going forward at a fixed price but they still bring down the price every week, depending on whatever whim or humour they are in on a Monday morning.
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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Mr. Carroll should know. It is not a question of whether he thinks it is; he should know.
Mr. Philip Carroll:
I am told that is not the case. Let me put it that way. There are significant contracts among different processors with farmer finishers in particular. We deal with the finishers to a large extent. We do not know what the nature of those contracts are because that is a commercial matter for individual companies. One is not going to find that between a farmer and a processor nor a processor and a retailer. That is off territory, from our perspective here. I can tell the Senator that there are significant contracts but not all farmers want contracts. Not all farmers look for contracts.
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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I am not talking about farmers having contracts. I am talking about the processors having contracts that they are-----
Mr. Philip Carroll:
The processor contracts are the very same. They do have all of the things, I suspect, that the Senator has suggested they have in the contracts. One of the key things they have is a supply contract for a particular period, probably at a particular price. When the market situation changes, then there have to be adjustments. As the Senator said, one cannot produce to a contract, the value of which was formulated in the early stages, and expect when the entire market explodes, as it does, that one can continue to do that. The way in which that was represented back to farmers was that clearly processors had to meet those contracts but what they had to do in 2025 was compete for the animals, which is what drove up the price. The farmer got the return from the competition that was going on between the processors, retailers, wholesalers, and buyers generally. That is how it is reflected back.
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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What contracts and markets have been lost? We must take into consideration the fact that the number of animals being killed every year is down. The CSO announced today that it is down by 14.8%. The type of animal is a younger animal or a dairy-bred animal. That means the tonnage must be way down. Have we lost major contracts? If so, how come that is not being publicised? We are hearing a good news story every year about our beef exports. According to Bord Bia, everything is up, we have new markets and trade missions going all over the world and they are all bringing back good news but we are killing lower numbers of smaller cattle in tonnage terms. If we talk about tonnage and forget about financial yield and animal numbers, our beef exports are way down. Is that what the witnesses are telling us?
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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Our suckler numbers are way down and we are depending on dairy-bred beef, so I would imagine carcase weights are not -----
Mr. Dale Crammond:
They were up by about 25 kilos, on average, across the industry. That helped in offsetting some of the reduced throughput. We lost 213,000 animals from the kill last year. We are down about 70,000 so far this year. The Bord Bia prediction is that we will come out somewhere near where we were last year, at about 1.59 million animals. However, a lot of that will depend on what happens the market in the second half of the year and whether we can get some buoyancy back into the marketplace.
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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Is there no way of predicting what might happen to the market? We hear about hedging and fuel prices and that good, progressive companies have their fuel prices hedged. Can it not be predicted what will happen going forward?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
It really is difficult to try to predict what the market is going to be. If we all knew that, we might all be in very different roles. Price is a supply and demand issue. We have to understand that the market is very transient. What the market is like today may be very different in two months.
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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Is there a race to the bottom within the market?
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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How come we hear about Irish quality beef being displaced by what we know is coming from Brazil? Is there a race to the bottom within the market? Quality does not seem to matter any more.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
We do not know how much product is being displaced by Brazil. We are starting to see an increase in southern hemisphere beef coming into the UK. We have seen some of the UK retailers trial that beef. They have got on all right with it. The margins are very small. The concern is that they will look to grow that over time but as Mr. Carroll said, we operate in a global marketplace. China now has a 55% tariff on Brazilian beef going into that country above a certain quota level. That is going to create a short term challenge over the next two years but that-----
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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Our quality maintained us for a long time.
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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It sounds like it is gone now. That is not going to be-----
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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Can we not command a premium price for a premium product?
Paul Daly (Fianna Fail)
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However, we seem to be lowering to the price of the inferior quality product. We are going down and fighting them in the muck, in the gutter.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
The inferior quality product undoubtedly has had an impact but the bigger issue is consumer sentiment and consumer challenges. We are in a cost-of-living crisis. In the UK, the situation is very difficult. The consumer has moved away from beef. That is the reality. If we look at consumer sentiment and the work Bord Bia has done through its survey, 70% of consumers say that they want to purchase more beef over the next year or two. There is positive sentiment there but it is going to have to be at a price point that has been lower than the price we saw last year. That is what the market reality is telling us.
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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I have a question on cattle that come in for slaughter where it is discovered that they potentially have had TB. Inspectors find lesions and the farmer does not get anything for the animal. The State pays the farmer for the cost of whatever number of cattle come in. What actually happens to that herd or to whatever number of animals are suspected of having TB? What happens to the meat? Does it go into cold storage? Does it get used for something else?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
I am not 100% sure of that. I know there is an insurance scheme that farmers can opt into so that if certain animals are condemned in the factory, the farmer will get paid for those animals. That certainly happens. There is a scheme there under which the farmer will get paid. At certain times we will see that six or seven kilos might get trimmed off a carcase if there is a lesion. That is removed. Again, the farmer should get paid for that.
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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Yes, and they do get paid, whether it is through the insurance or through the State. My question is about what happens to the meat. We know it is fine for human consumption. It is not dangerous, if an animal has TB. Do Mr. Carroll know what happens to that meat?
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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Does the factory get it?
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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The witnesses can come back to us on that.
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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I would appreciate that.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Could the witnesses verify and clarify that? They can come back to us on it later.
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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The factory does not pay for it. It is the insurance or the State that is paying for the cattle and the factory gets-----
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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The witnesses should know that.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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The Department pays the difference in the price.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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If the answer is not immediately there, the witnesses can follow up with the committee.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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It is out there.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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That meat is still going on the shelf but they are not paying for it.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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They pay less for it. Whatever the animal is valued at, they pay less and the Department-----
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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But the consumer does not know.
Joe Cooney (Clare, Fine Gael)
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No, the consumer does not know.
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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If the witnesses could get back to us and clarify that-----
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Please come back to the committee with clarity on that point, rather than the uncertainty, back and forth.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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It is a hugely important point.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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One moment, please. It is a hugely important point to clarify. If there is uncertainty on it, we want to remove that. If it is not going to be clarified here and now, immediately, that is okay. The witnesses can send on the information to us and we can get clarity on it.
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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No, and that is not what I was getting at.
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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No. The question was more around who was benefiting-----
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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-----from that animal.
That is really my question.
I could be wrong in my figures and my understanding of this. The witnesses might just clarify. They are saying there was 14.5% less. Sorry, I have lots of figures written down and I do not know what they are for. They were saying to Senator Daly there was 14.5%-----
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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Yes. There was 14.5% less in the kill. Am I correct in saying that the exports are not 14.5% down? Is there a slight variation in them?
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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Is it by 14.5%? Is it the same as what the kill is?
Mr. Philip Carroll:
What might be confusing about this is that the kill level, or processing level, was down 14%, that is, the volume, but the price was higher. The value in 2025 was higher by somewhere between €550 million and €600 million. That is probably where that confusion lies. That is directly attributed to the price that the product was sold for. Notwithstanding that we were selling less product, the value of what was sold last year was greater than it would otherwise have been had we been at a higher level.
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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Going from last week's announcement by the EU where it took Brazil off the safe imports list, if it is a thing the Irish Government decides to follow suit on and decides not to take it, might it change our market if Brazilian beef is taken off? Will it rectify quicker than we are hoping? I know we still have others importing into us.
Mr. Philip Carroll:
There are two parts to that. The first is the volumes that are going into the UK, which is different, as the Senator knows, from the EU. We do not know whether they will follow that course. The other part of that from an EU perspective is the Mercosur agreement kicks in and it will directly impact that. We will have to wait and see what happens in September and whether the Commission enforces what is a provisional threat at present.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
The way I would describe it is the Mercosur is a very significant threat. We stood shoulder to shoulder with the farm organisations in opposing that agreement, but it is probably not the main short-term threat, as I would see it. That is probably driven just by the increase in Polish imports coming into the EU and the increase in Australian imports coming in. In the short term, they probably will be a bigger challenge. In the long term-----
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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Very quickly, with my last-----
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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There only a few months from now until September. Will Brazil hugely up its exports to us to get as much in as possible?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
Obviously, it is not able to export at the moment because it is not meeting the phytosanitary rules. The Commission is reviewing that at the moment. I imagine that Brazil is working hard to try and justify. That will be challenging. That is really a matter for the EU Commission in terms of the decision it makes ultimately around that and we will have to abide by that decision.
Mr. Philip Carroll:
I will add a bit to the Senator's question around Brazil. We possibly could have been in a worse situation than we currently are, and that is bad enough, were it the case that Trump had maintained his tariffs on Brazil, which were at 50% and he reduced to 10%. That brought Brazil back into the US on greater volume. Had it not been reversed, we could have been more vulnerable.
Joanne Collins (Sinn Fein)
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Let us keep asking him to reduce those tariffs so.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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Am I correct that for farmers or whoever brings cattle to the processing plant in their jeeps and trailers or whatever, the meat is processed and it goes back out on a refrigerator truck?
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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It gets loaded onto a refrigerator truck and goes out to wherever it is going. It is packed and whatever. Am I right in saying that refrigerator trucks come back into the factory, and that they bring meat into the processing factory in refrigerator trucks?
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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What I am told is that refrigerator trucks are coming in loaded up, they are being unloaded, and they are being loaded back up again and back out.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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Meat.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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Mr. Carroll is telling me this is not happening. I am told that this is happening in plants.
Mr. Philip Carroll:
What may happen and what may confuse this is that within companies that have multiple facilities, and they may slaughter animals and dress them into quarters. In other words, they do not debone in the plant within which they slaughter. They will put the carcases on a truck and they will send it to one of their own plants. That is all permitted and it is all done under the control of the veterinary staff in the Department. They have deboning capacity greater than what they require in that second plant and what they do is move it to that second plant, which means they have consolidated their boning and are more efficient in their production.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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It is processed and brought back out again.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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Okay. I am also hearing that there is a mad rush on a Friday evening to go around and collect up meat. If they are in such a hurry to get the meat onto the boat on a Friday evening, and we are saying that our exports are down, a lot of the truck drivers that I am speaking to are wondering why they are driving all over the countryside collecting meat to bring it back out if there is such a decline in exports because they are not seeing it. I am wondering when those trucks go out, wherever they go to whatever country, are they coming back empty or are they bringing back meat? Are they consolidating the costs of driving out there and rather than driving back empty, they are bringing back more meat when they are coming back?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
Friday evening is a very busy period for any meat processor because they are rushing out to meet the weekend demand. Thursday evening and Friday evening are the two busiest evenings of the week in terms of meat processing. The volumes are still going out. They are just reduced from what they were. What comes back on those trucks is a matter for the hauliers. I would not be 100% clear. I suspect any haulier involved will try to be as efficient as possible in terms of maximising backloads. They are certainly not bringing back meat.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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On that, we will talk about Poland. I know this because it involves a friend of a Polish man. He asked for a break for the weekend. His friend was coming over from Poland with a Polish truck full of meat. It was coming in on a Friday evening, it was being processed and was back out on a Sunday. It was stamped and labelled in Ireland and everything, and had gone out. I do not know whether it was Bord Bia stamped but it was processed in Ireland and back out. Have the witnesses heard of that happening? Is it still happening?
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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This did happen.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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I do not think anybody is going to give me a straight answer on it anyway.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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It was Poland.
Mr. Philip Carroll:
----- which is what we are talking about, and if that is going back into an Irish processing plant, that is controlled by the Department of agriculture veterinary staff. If there is any illegal element to that which may be asserted by the question, then that will be dealt with by the Department. I cannot imagine it happening because the Department is there from the moment the plant opens, at 7 a.m., before animals go into the lairage to the last light going out. There is a chief vet on site.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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In general, do factories work a seven-day week or what is the story there?
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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Yes. Do the factories work weekends?
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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Okay. It has come to my attention that there are a lot of cars in car parks. I wonder why the cars would be there at the weekend if things are on a go-slow approach.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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I would not think there would be that many cars for maintenance.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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I am just bringing it to Mr. Carroll's attention and asking if anybody knows.
Bord Bia conducts audits of processor members, such as those under the meat processor quality assurance scheme. Are those audits announced or unannounced?
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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When HIQA goes into nursing homes, some visits are announced and some visits are unannounced. What is the percentage? With one plant, would it only be a question of if something was happening that was underhanded-----
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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We are discussing the number of cattle and the price.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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It is all to do with meat factories.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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No, our focus is on the-----
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Stop for one moment. Our focus is on the numbers going through, the volume and the price. That is what the witnesses are briefed to come in on.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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Okay. We will go back to the price. I will not get an answer to the Bord Bia question. They should be unannounced, by right. By announcing the audits, you do not get the same level of transparency. I suppose I cannot ask a question on the Food Safety Authority either, can I?
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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It is not today's brief but if the Deputy wishes, it can be communicated to the witnesses. I need to move onto Deputy Lawless.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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I have one more question on offal.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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There will be a second round.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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We will see how we are fixed. We may have a chance. I call Deputy Lawless.
Paul Lawless (Mayo, Aontú)
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I thank the witnesses before us. The central issue is not necessarily price but price volatility for farmers. Price volatility is creating major financial exposure for farmers because farmers are making commitments months or years in advance about purchasing cattle, buying store cattle, committing to winter feeding, fertiliser and all of the input costs that arise. All of a sudden, the factories combined and collectively pulled the prices. That is leaving enormous financial exposure on farmers. We talk about sustainability across every single sector but the only man we do not talk about, in terms of making his business sustainable, is the farmer. It is shocking that we are doing this. Every few years, it happens. We had a good year last year and farmers invested heavily in farming systems, purchasing cattle and so on. This year, we are back to square one.
The saddest thing is that I know farmers who have purchased at very high prices and their input costs are very high. They now will make a loss. When they bring their cattle to the factory gates, they will make a loss. That is devastating. It is devastating for the farmer individually but it is devastating for a farming family. It is devastating for a son or daughter watching his or her father or mother in this cycle where they are the last person to be looked after. The witnesses will no doubt make the point that these are international markets, etc. My question to Meat Industry Ireland is this: has it taken a cut to its profits? If so, is it making a loss? This summer and at the back end of the year, there are farmers across Ireland who will be bringing cattle to the factory gates at a loss. What percentage of Meat Industry Ireland's contracts has it made a loss on? It is a major issue and we have to address it. I am very interested to hear what the industry's plans and suggestions are around making this model sustainable.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
That is an obvious challenge. We addressed that earlier with Deputy Aird. Last year, meat processors made a loss at certain times of the year. The Agri-Food Regulator clearly shows that in terms of the hindquarter and forequarter selling price compared to the price of cattle at that time. Obviously, there was a correction in terms of the retail contracts later in the year. That happened. Yes, processors are also exposed to the vagaries of the market from time to time. As we have said, there is a lot of product going into cold storage at the moment. It will be very difficult to make a return from that product once it goes in and once we have to pay for that. We all accept the challenges this issue creates, particularly for the farmer. What can we do about it? We would be happy to have a conversation on that to see how we could manage that a little bit better.
Mr. Carroll has talked about contracts between finishers and processors. A lot of farmers have contracts and are paid above the market rate at that time when they go to sell their cattle. That might even have been referenced in the farming media recently. That is the reality. That is happening out there but it is very difficult. It is very difficult in other sectors also. We see it in the pig sector. In certain years, it is very good. In certain years, it is very bad. That is farming. That is the business we are involved in at the moment.
Paul Lawless (Mayo, Aontú)
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What is the typical duration of a contract from MII?
Paul Lawless (Mayo, Aontú)
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From the plants who are members of MII.
Paul Lawless (Mayo, Aontú)
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What is the typical duration of a supply contract from a meat processing plant?
Paul Lawless (Mayo, Aontú)
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In Mr. Crammond's view, are there any price or market signals that he can signal to farmers across the country to outline that we expect prices to increase or decrease? That is the point I am making. How long are the contracts, typically, and how can we restore some sustainability in the market?
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Just to clarify, is the Deputy asking about the customer down the street and the contract with the customer? Mr. Crammond is answering about the contract with his supplier.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Is Deputy Lawless asking about the contract with the UK?
Paul Lawless (Mayo, Aontú)
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It is both, to be honest.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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There is no answer coming on the contract with the guy in the UK who MII is supplying.
Paul Lawless (Mayo, Aontú)
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That is my question. We are trying to get to the contracts with the purchasers. Those are what we are interested in. If there is transparency for contracts in the meat industry over two, three or five years with the suppliers in the UK and European markets, that will give an indication and confidence to farmers. Perhaps it will outline to farmers that they should actually be cautious here as there are headwinds coming.
Paul Lawless (Mayo, Aontú)
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I do not have Bord Bia here in front of me, I have Meat Industry Ireland and I am asking Mr. Crammond. It seems to me that his job, primarily, is to look after the plants. However, if he and his colleagues do not take a longer term view of this and the farmer is continually suffering as a result of this market, ultimately, there will be no plants because there will be no farmers to take cattle to the plants. MII needs to take a longer-term view of this and to ensure the market is fair for the farmers as well.
Mr. Philip Carroll:
There are two issues that might be conflated there, as the Cathaoirleach has said. One is the relationship between the farmer and the processor, and the other is the relationship between the processor and the retailer. There are different provisions in contracts. Mr. Crammond has covered the one on the farm level processor. The Deputy said there needs to be transparency in contracts between processors and retailers or wholesalers, or whoever it is that is purchasing. Why would any commercial company reveal the terms of their contracts to each other? First, it would require both parties to agree to that. Second, why would we give all of that information to our competitors?
Where is the logic in that question?
Paul Lawless (Mayo, Aontú)
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Why are quoted beef prices dropping by about 30 cent per kilogram when the actual prices paid per kilogram are moving much slower? There is quite a significant difference. What is the reason for that?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
As I alluded to, that may well be the result of some contracts finishers had with their processors over that winter period. Quotes have been falling back. I do not think they have been falling back anywhere like 30 cent per week but we have seen a decline and we accept that in terms of where cattle prices were.
Michael Cahill (Kerry, Fianna Fail)
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I welcome the witnesses and thank them for their statements. How do they see the outlook for cattle prices for the remainder of this year and into 2027, especially in the context of rising costs, rising fertiliser costs, the cost-of-living crisis and the fuel crisis? Do they believe that they will hold up reasonably well or do they have any major concerns?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
I do not have a crystal ball so I will be very cautious in my remarks. It is really difficult to say. If you look at the fundamentals of the global marketplace at the moment, things overall still look fairly positive for the beef industry. There is a declining herd in many of the major international markets, which is creating huge import demand into those markets, particularly the US. There is a bit of a challenge with China at the moment in terms of its safeguards but hopefully that will be temporary and be exhausted over the next two years so the fundamentals are still pretty good.
Consumers enjoy eating beef. The market surveys show that consumers want to engage with the beef category again. Unfortunately, prices got a little bit too high and that price elasticity broke. I was in the United States last week. They are more far more loyal to their beef products and their beef consumption than, unfortunately, we are here in Europe and the UK. They are continuing to pay those really high prices. Overall, I would say that the outlook is still positive. Prices are still high. If you look at the data in terms of the average farm incomes on beef farms last year, they are very positive. They probably will fall back this year but they will hopefully still be in profit and we cannot always say that if we look back over the past 20 to 25 years. I would say that it is just about finding that niche. There is a clearly a bit of a reset going on in the market at the moment. We will get to a certain point where the retailers will start to re-engage with the category, hopefully we will start to see some promotions happening again, that will drive that consumption and demand up and hopefully things will things will stabilise in the second half of the year leading into Christmas.
Michael Cahill (Kerry, Fianna Fail)
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What should the Government, the Minister, the Department and this committee do to ensure stability, success and good prices going forward for the farmer?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
I would address that in a number of ways. It is a very important question and I am glad the Deputy asked it because there is a role for everyone here from Government level to industry level working collaboratively with the farmers. That is what we have always tried to do. Mr. Carroll alluded to how Food Vision 2030 is being reviewed at the moment. We need to look at that very carefully. The Minister, Deputy Heydon, needs to come onto the pitch in that regard. We need to review that to see whether it has really worked for the beef sector over the past five years and whether the schemes we have are the most effective schemes. A lot of money is going into the beef sector. A lot of public funds are going into the sector. Is that money being used in the best possible way? I would like to see some kind of review around that going forward.
The industry has put a lot of money into schemes to support farmers. We funded the national genotype scheme to the tune of €7 million. We are funding the Teagasc signpost future beef programme, which is costing us €250,000 a year. We have helped fund Animal Health Ireland. The industry is really committed to trying to put the best industry we have in place so we can continue to market the beef we produce and return the best price to the farmer.
Our cost base at an industry level is under pressure. IBEC has made a number of recommendations to the Government on electricity prices. We need to see the Government do something in terms of subventions for some of the fixed costs. The labour rates in this country are out of control. I put that on the record. The Government increased permitted salaries by 30% overnight from €23,000 to €30,000 two years ago. It has increased them again this year from €30,000 to €32,691, which is a 9% increase. There is no justification for that. CSO wage rate data will show that the rate of increase is closer to 3%. Those sorts of decisions are really going to put the processing sector under pressure. The Government has indicated it wants to take the cost of employment permits to approximately €40,000 by the end of the decade. That decision needs to be revisited. It is a combination of factors; it is not just one.
Michael Cahill (Kerry, Fianna Fail)
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What are the witnesses' views on prices paid to farmers for TB reactors? Do they believe they are fair? Do they believe should be increased? I am asking that in the context of my office being approached by farmers who are being left out of pocket.
Mr. Philip Carroll:
I will add one point relating to what the Deputy said. The most significant problem our economy faces, apart from other things that are outside of the food sector, is the fact that energy costs here are way too high. Everybody knows that but nobody seems to be doing anything about it. What we really would like to see at the bare minimum is that we can reduce our energy dependency and our energy costs down to the average at European level. I do not think that is too big of an ask but if we do not start preparing to get to that point, we will be in even more trouble as we go forward. That applies to farmers and processors.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Do many MII plants have renewable energy?
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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I am conscious of time as two more members have not had an opportunity to speak yet and we are coming close to the appointed finishing time. Members have other questions they are keen to get in on as well, so I must give priority to those members who have not yet spoken. Senator Lynch is next.
Eileen Lynch (Fine Gael)
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I thank the witnesses for their attendance today. MII's initial statement very much outlines the situation. As we know, there has been a fall of almost €2 per kilogram in the past 12 months, which has crippled finishers. We know that while the price of calves is still quite high, for heavier cattle going to kill, we have seen a drop of almost €400 in the price since the start of the year. We know all of this and the witnesses outlined that very well but how do we solve it and what is the best way we can deal with it? Up to now, the Bord Bia sign denoting grass-fed origin was always our unique selling point. Do we need to do more in terms of marketing?
I appreciate from looking at what the witnesses set out that demand for more expensive meat has gone down because the cost was so high. From a marketing point of view, is there anything we can do to counter that? Our beef industry is incredibly vulnerable given that 90% of beef is exported. Markets and the international economy are volatile so we are very much at the mercy of that. The witnesses mentioned the massive drop in our exports to the UK and how a lot of New Zealand beef is coming in there, which previously would not have been the case. The UK-New Zealand trade deal has obviously made things a lot easier but when you look at the like of Dawn Meats, which is a member of MII, you see that it has bought into Alliance, which is a big meat producer in New Zealand.
There is a lot of speculation and hearsay, although it is only hearsay, that the likes of Dawn Meats is using its Irish connections to feed New Zealand beef into what had been Irish contracts. That is commercial business; I get that. If that is happening, however, that is very difficult for us here. Dawn Meats falls under MII. I accept that Dawn Meats is providing a cheaper product and there is a cost-of-living crisis, etc., but how can we resolve that?
The UK and Brazil do not currently have a trade deal but there is speculation that something could happen. How would such a trade deal affect Ireland? As bad as things are, that kind of trade deal could crucify the exporting of Irish beef to the UK.
We have always had Brazilian beef coming into this country but since the EU's adoption of the Mercosur agreement we have not seen as great an influx as much as we thought we would. Earlier this month, the European Commission announced its decision regarding the non-compliance of Brazilian beef, as we knew and as we said, with EU regulations surrounding the use of antimicrobials and antibiotics. If Brazil is found to remain non-compliant with that by the stipulated date in September and if, therefore, its beef is excluded from Mercosur and banned from coming into the European Union,will that have an effect and will it be an opportunity for Ireland to take advantage?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
The Senator has raised quite a few issues and I will try to answer. Between the UK-New Zealand free trade agreement and the UK-Australia free trade agreement, I would worry more about the Australian agreement because of the quantity involved, which is 30,000 tonnes straightaway while the New Zealand figure is 12,000 tonnes. The Senator mentioned that Dawn Meats invested in Alliance Group, which is predominantly a lamb plant. It supplies some beef and I suspect some beef may have been coming into the UK before Dawn Meats made its investment. That is a commercial matter and I will not say anything more on that. Dawn Meats has made that investment.
On Brazilian beef, clearly if Brazil negotiated a trade agreement with the UK, it would create further pressures in the marketplace. An agreement has a long way to go. The Labour Government in the UK is a little bit challenged at the moment and I am not sure that negotiating a trade agreement with Brazil is at the top of its agenda.
We have to wait and see what happens with Brazil in terms of the audit by the EU Commission. The EU has put a marker down to Brazil to say that it is up to them to prove that they can meet our sanitary and phytosanitary, SPS, requirements. There is a lot of suspicion out there that they cannot do that. That is now a matter for the Commission. If the Commission grants that approval, then it will have to conduct audits at a very significant level to ensure that that is the case. As an industry, we can only ask that those checks and balances are being carried out and that the product that is coming into our marketplace is fair.
We must remember that we export 90% of our products all over the world. We cannot completely close our markets off to trade either. It would be nice to be able to do that but we live in the real world and we will have to accept some level of competition coming into our markets. What can we do about that? We need to double-down on what we are good at. We have built up a very positive reputation, and rightly so, for the world-class beef products we produce. We need to double-down on that. We have the highest standards of animal welfare and when it comes to climate in terms of the carbon efficiency of our product. We really need to focus in on these issues again.
We need the Bord Bia quality assurance schemes more than ever. If we want to maintain our place among blue-chip customers in Europe and the UK in the face of these increased imports coming in, we cannot walk away from these standards. We actually need to double-down on them.
Eileen Lynch (Fine Gael)
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Is Mr. Crammond saying that the reduction we are seeing in the UK market is not directly linked to the associated cost and that it is not necessarily down to the cost of living? Yes, we need all of these standards, but do we need to put them out there more in the context of our product?
Mr. Crammond mentioned the increased amount of dairy beef that is exported to the UK. Is that the problem? Before, dairy beef had almost a stigma and nobody wanted it, whereas now consumers seem less concerned about what animal the meat comes from. Do we need to focus more on our quality and sell it on its USP, or is it more about getting it out there because of the cost of living and the cost that meat here reached that was the problem in markets, as well as all the other issues around new trade agreements? What can we do? We can do nothing about other trade agreements.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
No, we cannot; the Senator is right. We are only starting to see the challenges to the beef industry caused by Brexit. Both the dairy beef and suckler beef sectors massively contribute to our output. As I said earlier, we will always try to match the products to the marketplaces that will pay the highest price for the individual products. That is very straightforward and we work very closely with Bord Bia on that. I reiterate that we must keep doubling back to what we are good at, and we need to do that now more than ever.
Joe Cooney (Clare, Fine Gael)
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I apologise, I had to attend another meeting earlier. I thank Mr. Carroll for his opening statement.
He outlined that export values were up 23%, at €3.5 billion, even though volumes had significantly reduced, while the UK value increased by 25% to €1.6 billion. However, I read recently in the Irish Farmers Journal that winter finishers are reporting losses of between €300 and €500 per head. We are exploring lower volumes, it generates far more value and yet, unfortunately, farmers are losing money. It would appear that once again the premier producer is paying the price. What steps are being taken to ensure that beef farmers in County Clare and other parts of the country get a fair share of the value being generated in the export markets?
Mr. Philip Carroll:
I thank the Deputy for his question. It is really around what has happened in the market here. People can clearly see where that value transferred in 2025. Every farmer in the country experienced that in their wallet. What actually happened was a surge was created because there was deemed to be a tightness in supply in the market. That was consequent on the very strong publication around what the reduction in supply was. In the UK, it was around 2%, in Europe 2.5% and it was similar elsewhere in the world, particularly in Ireland as we saw from the 214,000 animals that were not available on the market last year. There was a genuine squeeze in supply at that stage and throughout the year - I touched on this a bit earlier - until the point at which the price on the market became so high that there was a resistance to it. Bear in mind that there is the farmer, the processor, the retailer, the wholesaler and the consumer, all of which are influential in the market. What was happening in 2025 was that fellows were beating up themselves and everybody else to get as many animals as they could to fill the contracts they had agreed with the third party - the wholesaler and the retailer. That is where we have ended up. As a consequence, we got too high. People made a decision, particularly consumers, that they could not afford this and would buy something else or would buy cheaper beef products. That is why we have seen that value reduction in forequarters and hindquarters and the cuts associated with those. Everything has been affected. For example, in 2026, the visible lean, VL, content of the meat product has reduced from €6 per kilo in the wholesale market to €4 per kilo. That is explaining why prices have dropped.
Why would prices be higher in Ireland when we do not have that market, apart from us being a first importer into the UK market? We are not a first importer into the wider European markets. Every single one of the countries we are being compared with in the benchmark price are all big countries with populations greater than 20 million, so that is their internal market.
Our internal market numbers fewer than 5 million, and consumers right now, driven by price, are buying less beef product. We have seen that 49% - half the population - are saying that. If the price is way up and there is resistance in the market, it is only going one way. How can we correct this? Mr. Crammond has talked at length during the meeting about how we can reach the point where there is balance in the market. That is where we need to be, but balance is not there yet. I ask the committee to also bear in mind that - we have almost catastrophised it, but it is not a catastrophe - we are dealing with a short cycle in which farmers and processors alike have been dealt a body blow. That is the truth, but we do not influence that. An adjustment is taking place now. That adjustment does not seem to be complete yet.
There has always been volatility. Every year, there is a degree of volatility and we have had the greatest level of it in the past 12 months. However, when we get to a stable position, I hope, as Mr. Crammond does, that we will get to a price point again where we are competitive, can sell everything and increase the value of VLs, steak cuts and round cuts. I hope we can get to that point in the autumn, but I cannot predict it. No one can, because no one was able to predict the highs and lows we have reached now.
Joe Cooney (Clare, Fine Gael)
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I hope that will happen.
I am running out of time. Independent butchers in County Clare and across the country depend on consistent, competitive prices and access to quality Irish beef. Given the increased concentration in beef processing, what assurance can Meat Industry Ireland give smaller independent retail butchers in the hearts of rural towns and villages that they will not be disadvantaged in access, pricing and supply allocation, relative to the large retail companies?
Joe Cooney (Clare, Fine Gael)
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It would not want to be going on, because we want them to survive and continue in business.
Joe Cooney (Clare, Fine Gael)
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There is concern out there with some of them.
The opening statement pointed to record live calf and weanling exports of more than 300,000 annually. These animals are being purchased in the Netherlands, Spain and Italy. Why is that the case? From the perspective of food security, carbon footprint, local added value and supply chain, we need to actively reconsider why we have closed almost all our local slaughter houses.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
In some ways, we have been victims of our own success when it comes to live exports, with the quality of cattle farmers in this country produce. We would love for those animals to stay in Ireland, be processed in Ireland and have that added value in our facilities. Ultimately, that would benefit everyone, but we operate in a European marketplace. Live shippers are very active in marts and markets all over the country and they will continue to be active. That creates a level of competition in the marketplace, which we have to accept. That is the commercial reality we operate in at the moment.
Joe Cooney (Clare, Fine Gael)
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I presume that will continue going forward.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
I cannot see anything changing dramatically around that. There are some concerns about the Dutch situation and live calves being shipped there, but up to this point nothing has happened in that area. There has probably been some fall-off in live exports to Poland this year because of bluetongue, but the option to sell to the marts is available to farmers and to the live exporters to buy the cattle. It has always been a part of Irish farming to some degree.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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We have exceeded the agreed time. I have a few questions and a number of members are keen to get in a few questions as well, so if it is agreeable, we will do a quick-fire round from members and I will ask a few questions.
Irish farmers are producing quality, grass-fed beef with traceability from farm to fork and they feel their work is not reflected in the price they get in the factory at the end of the day. Meat Industry Ireland depends on them. They are its suppliers. Without them, its factory has no purpose. Has it looked at what would be a break-even price for them, for example, a suckler farmer or someone who is finishing, because they are under pressure in a whole range of areas? Does it look at the pressure its suppliers are under when it is making out a price? Is that taken into account in any way?
The price of beef for consumers in the market, whether in the butcher's shop, supermarket or restaurant, rose dramatically last year. Meat Industry Ireland thinks it is on the way down. In what kind of timeline does it expect that to reach the market for consumers?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
I will not speak for retailers because, ultimately, they make their own decisions. They are the purchasers of our product. I hope that, as the price has fallen for the farmer, it will be reflected in the retailer price and that retailers will start to engage again in serious promotion efforts in the second half of the year to drive demand. That is what I will say on that.
On the first question, we fully acknowledge that without farmer suppliers, we do not have an industry. Despite everything, there is a good relationship between farmer suppliers and processors. We all want the best for the industry. Everyone in this room wants the best for the Irish beef industry, but from time to time, as we are seeing at the moment, we are simply challenged by the vagaries and transience of the marketplace. However, things can improve and I hope they will and we will get back to an even keel with less volatility in the marketplace. Volatility is the key issue and it has been talked about a lot today.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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I thank Mr. Carroll and Mr. Crammond for coming today. They came here as witnesses. A few weeks ago, other witnesses were here and - you could not write the book - they told us we had to bring in Brazilian beef as a buffer in case we ran out of Irish beef. Today, though, Meat Industry Ireland is telling us that every cold store in the country is full and we cannot sell it, and that that is why the price of beef is dropping. It is no wonder Irish farmers are frustrated. They are gobsmacked by why they are hearing today. That is my question.
Mr. Philip Carroll:
That is not the reason the cattle prices have reduced. That completely ignores everything we have said today about how the market across the globe, including Europe and the UK, has declined substantially and quickly. That is the reason. The cold stores are full because there is no demand in the market at the moment at an appropriate price.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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But we are bringing in Brazilian beef to prop up the market.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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We did bring it in.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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That is what the witnesses told us.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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I need to move on to the next Deputy.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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Meat Industry Ireland does not want to hear it. It is the truth.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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I need to move on.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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It should not have been.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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It does not matter whether it is a half day's production. It should not be here.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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I need to move on to Deputy Newsome Drennan.
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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I remember the beef going into intervention. I was fattening cattle at the time.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Deputy, we agreed to a quick and brief-----
William Aird (Laois, Fine Gael)
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Yes. I got my point across, and-----
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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To be fair, I have given the Deputy additional time and we need to move to Deputy Newsome Drennan.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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I will come in on the issue of beef offal. It was valued at €155 million in 2025, which was up 12% on 2024.
The farmers get paid only for the dead weight. That offal then goes from there to elsewhere, whether as pet food, to medical or to all these other areas, but the farmer does not get paid for this. The farmer does not get paid for the fifth quarter. I know there are processors that are also involved in pet food manufacturing. Is that kind of like "Sure I will take that and throw it into my other plant and I will make, make, make, win, win, win"? The farmer does not get anything for the fifth quarter.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
No, the fifth quarter, or the offal products, is considered in the price of cattle the farmer pays. We have a challenge in the international marketplace in that we would like access to a lot of markets to export that offal and we do not have access to some of those markets at the moment, particularly into China, if we could resolve the bluetongue issue. Ultimately, the farmer buys the animal. As regards the price of cattle, it is the overall price of that animal that is considered in setting that price.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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There is live weight, dead weight and the weight they get. The head and the other bits are cut off but they are all usable. Is about €138 to €155 basically the value of it? Then there are the hides and so on. I know there are truckloads of hides going abroad. Somebody is making money on this. What I am saying is that if a plant has a dog, cat or other pet food company to make whatever food and it is taking that product, it is making money because it has somewhere to go for it. Is it the case that these people whom I am talking about - and the witnesses know whom I am talking about - should be paying the farmer for it?
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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But you are paying them only for the dead weight, the throat and the-----
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Thank you, Deputy. I call Deputy Kenny.
Natasha Newsome Drennan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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Why not put an offal weight on it and a price for it?
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Deputy, I need to move on. I call Deputy Kenny.
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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I wish to raise just two small things. First of all, it was mentioned - and it was mentioned here before - how companies use meat products from other countries that they mix in with Irish products sometimes to produce their output. I am just wondering about contamination and cross-contamination in respect of all that. Brazil is obviously the one people look to, but I refer to other countries as well, where they are producing output where they have got products that have some Irish meat in it and other ingredients and products from other countries. How much regulation is there around all that and ensuring that there is not any contamination in respect of that?
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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Well, in product we are exporting, but it may be product-----
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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That is when we are talking about raw beef, but in some cases it may be processed a little further than that, where it may be a product that is exported, not just the beef.
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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And they are not suppliers of meat from other countries outside or in the EU.
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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My other short question is about the exports and the export of product to other countries. It was mentioned that there were so many cattle exporters abroad and cattle are now being slaughtered in other countries. Obviously, whatever-----
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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But the big benefit of that to the farmer in Ireland was that it created a competition and a market, and that is huge value for them as well. Does that mean that if we continue to export at reasonably high levels, we will see more and more of a shortage for the processors here?
Mr. Dale Crammond:
As I said, we would clearly prefer if those animals stayed in the country and were processed and had that value added here in our processing facilities. With respect, though, the reality of the marketplace and those live exporters will continue to come in. I do sometimes wonder how they are able to come in and purchase cattle at the prices they do so, export them outside this country and still make money from them. As I said, though, that is the reality we live with.
Martin Kenny (Sligo-Leitrim, Sinn Fein)
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Perhaps if processors were to trade at a better price, they would not-----
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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I call Senator Lynch.
Eileen Lynch (Fine Gael)
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I am very concerned looking at the reduction in the kill last year. We are already down, I think, 80,000 year to date this year. Now, I appreciate that at the moment prices are down and ours are among the lowest in Europe. That is grand, and that is all to do with the market, but when we see such a vast reduction year on year in terms of the animals being killed and being produced here, do the witnesses think this will be a major problem in the future in terms of reduction? It will lead to food security problems. I understand that at the moment, due to the volatility of the market, the price is down - that is grand - but I do not think we are talking enough about the massive reduction. When lads get out of keeping cattle, it is very difficult for them to get back into it. At the current prices, a lot of lads are saying it is not worth it for them. I think this will lead to further problems down the road in terms of our output.
Mr. Dale Crammond:
We fully accept that the price of cattle has fallen and that has created a difficulty in the marketplace. We also have to reflect that, by historic levels, cattle prices are still at a very positive level and a lot of farmers will continue to make money in beef this year. Do I share the Senator's concerns? Absolutely. Of course we share them. As regards that whole piece around the generational renewal, we are really going to have to engage in that in a serious way in the context of the next CAP. We have the Presidency of the European Union now. First of all, the Minister needs to ensure that we get a proper budget for our next CAP and then that there are appropriate resources allocated to that issue around generational renewal. As I have said, and despite what some people think, we will always try to return the maximum value from the marketplace to the farmer. That leaves a gap from time to time, and the public and the EU purse and the national purse have always been there. We need to continue to have those resources available to us. That is the system we operate here. Food security has moved up the agenda, thankfully, at a European level. It had fallen down the agenda a lot. We need to keep it up there now and we need to ensure not just that we talk about food security but also that the appropriate budget is allocated to ensure that that becomes a reality.
Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North-West, Fianna Fail)
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Gabhaim buíochas le gach duine. Mar a luaigh mé cheana féin, tá feirmeoirí an-bhuartha mar gheall ar an bpraghas a fhaigheann siad ar na beithígh agus ar an bpraghas a chuireann an monarchana ar fáil dóibh. Is é sin an fáth ar theastaigh uainn an t-ábhar seo a phlé anseo inniu – chun díriú isteach ar an mbealach a dtagtar ar an bpraghas agus chun a chinntiú go mbeidh todhchaí ann d'fheirmeoirí mairteola ach go háirithe.
Leis sin, tá an t-am breise caite againn. Mo bhuíochas libh go léir, go háirithe ar lá breá grianmhar mar seo. I thank everybody who has participated, especially on such a sunshiny day and with people keen to be out there. It really reflects the intensity of feeling among members and farmers about the price they are getting for their beef. I thank the witnesses for their participation on behalf of the committee. That brings today's discussion to a conclusion, and the meeting now stands adjourned.