Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Wednesday, 11 May 2022

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media

Elimination of Abuse Directed Toward Referees, Officials, and Players in Sport: Discussion

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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Today's meeting has been convened with representatives from Sport Ireland, the Federation of Irish Sport, FIS, and officials from the Department of Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media, who join us to discuss the elimination of any and all abuse of referees, officials, and players in sport.

On behalf of the committee, I warmly welcome our witnesses. Dr. Una May, CEO of Sport Ireland, is joined by Mr. David Gash, communications and public affairs manager. I also welcome Ms Mary O'Connor, a very familiar face at these hearings, who is the FIS CEO. Finally, I welcome Mr. Cian Ó Lionáin, assistant secretary with responsibility for tourism and sport, and Mr. Micheál Ó Conaire, principal officer with responsibility for sports policy, Department of Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media.

The format of the meeting is such that I will invite witnesses to give their opening statements, which are limited to five minutes. This will be followed by questions from members of the committee. The witnesses may be aware that the committee will publish the opening statements on its web page after our meeting. Please note, to limit the risk of spreading Covid-19 we are encouraged as members, witnesses, and visitors to continue to wear face masks in crowded settings on the campus.

Before I ask our witnesses to deliver their opening statements I wish to explain some of the limitations in parliamentary privilege and the practice of the Houses with regard to references the witnesses may make to other persons in their evidence. The evidence of witnesses physically present or who give evidence from within the parliamentary precincts is protected, pursuant to the Constitution and statute, by absolute privilege.

Witnesses are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice that they should not criticise or make charges against any person or entity by name, or in such a way as to make him, her or it identifiable, or otherwise engage in speech that might be regarded as damaging to the good name of that person or entity. Therefore, if their statements are potentially defamatory in relation to the identity of a person or entity, they will be directed to discontinue their remarks.

Members are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not comment on, criticise, or make charges against a person outside the House or an official, either by name or in such a way as to make him or her identifiable. I remind members again of the constitutional requirement that members must be physically present within the confines of Leinster House, to participate in public meetings.

I cannot permit members to attend where they are not adhering to this constitutional requirement. I also ask members when contributing via Microsoft Teams to identify themselves when contributing for the benefit of the Debates Office staff preparing the Official Report. Members should mute their microphones when they are not contributing in order to reduce background noise and feedback. I remind everybody to switch off their mobile phone or put them to airplane mode to ensure they do not interfere with the recording of these proceedings.

With all that breathtaking housekeeping out of the way, I am delighted to get to the meaty part of our committee hearing today. I propose we move to presentations from our witnesses and guests. I will begin by inviting Dr. Una May, on behalf of Sport Ireland, to make her opening statement.

Dr. Una May:

I thank the committee for its invitation to address it this afternoon. While I have met the committee on a number of occasions in the past, this is my first time appearing before it as the chief executive of Sport Ireland.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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You are very welcome here in your new role. I should have said that at the start.

Dr. Una May:

I am joined by my colleague, Mr. David Gash, our communications and public affairs manager. The committee will have received our full opening statement, but being mindful of the time factor, I will only highlight some of the main points in it. I wish to emphasise Sport Ireland is unequivocal in its stance against abuse, discrimination and inappropriate behaviour at all levels of sport. Sport Ireland works with 66 national governing bodies, NGBs, of sport, their clubs and their 400,000 volunteers, coaches and administrators to develop an effective sport structure. These NGBs, clubs and volunteers are the cornerstone of sport in Ireland. Sport Ireland does not have any direct involvement in the handling of complaints made about abuse and-or discrimination encountered under the auspices of NGBs. NGBs, by their nature, are independent and autonomous organisations and, as such, are responsible for their own policies and procedures in the handling of these.

The majority of referees and match officials are voluntary positions and their safety, welfare and protection is a key priority. Without match officials, our sports cannot take place. As such, it is essential that support and training are provided regularly to ensure it is a worthwhile, rewarding and safe activity. Many NGBs have been proactive in this space, with codes of conduct in place along with sanctions for those found to be perpetrating abuse towards players, officials or referees. This is important as the voluntary construct of sport in Ireland needs to be protected. Volunteering in sport needs to remain an attractive proposition.

With regard to women in coaching, Sport Ireland recently published a Women in Coaching Toolkit, which addresses the barriers that have an impact on women in all aspects of their coaching life. The toolkit identifies sexism and gender-related issues among the barriers and challenges females face in coaching and provides suggested actions and helpful documents to assist with overcoming or addressing those barriers and challenges.

With regard to dispute resolution, all NGBs are expected to have a form of dispute resolution included in their constitution. Many of the larger and professionally led NGBs have their own in-house mechanism for dispute resolution. Sport Dispute Solutions Ireland, a service provided by the Federation of Irish Sport, is supported by Sport Ireland and is the mechanism of choice for many of the other NGBs. All Sport Ireland funded NGBs have updated their constitutions now to include a dispute resolution mechanism in them. While disciplinary processes play a vital role in penalising and dealing with improper behaviour, they are no substitute for education and the fostering of a welcome and open culture within a sport setting.

Turning to the NGB sector, the GAA, the Ladies' Gaelic Football Association, LGFA, and the Camogie Association all utilise the opportunity to report abuse through reporting it in the referee report form, which in turn begins the disciplinary processes for that particular case. The FAI has established a working group to review the regulations of the association with regard to the physical assault of referees and to consider the wider context of abuse of match officials. This group has advised strengthening sanctions and suspensions for abuse to match officials by players and club officials while continuing to showcase their "No Ref. No Game" message at all international fixtures. The IRFU established The Spirit of Rugby programme in 2017 to promote and protect the values of the game. It aims to support players, coaches, volunteers and parents and to educate those within the game about their rights and responsibilities on and off the field. The charter for Irish rugby outlines the values and every member agrees to abide by the charter on registration.

With regard to safety and safeguarding, Sport Ireland’s guiding principles and values for sport for children and young people is that it is fun, safe, inclusive and conducted in the spirit of fair play. A central goal for all involved in children’s sport is to provide a safe, positive and nurturing environment where children can develop and enhance their physical and social skills. It is also important to ensure an example is set for children and young people to ensure they live those values as they grow older and continue to participate in sport and physical activity. The aim of Sport Ireland’s Safeguarding Guidance for Children and Young People in Sport is to help sporting bodies to create a culture of safety that promotes the welfare of children and young people engaged in sporting activities. The guidance document clearly expresses Sport Ireland’s views on the importance of adopting and implementing a suite of policies and procedures, including codes of conduct, disciplinary procedures etc. Sport Ireland advises that each club or organisation should ensure it has adequate disciplinary, complaints and appeals procedures in place.

Regarding codes of conduct, it is noted that codes of conduct are an integral part of any club or sporting organisation. They set a standard of behaviour to help build a club’s culture and make it easier to deal with conduct and behaviour issues as they arise. These can be many and varied, from on-field incidents, sideline abuse and mismanagement to inappropriate social media posts, unfair treatment, poor sportsmanship and more. Codes of conduct set expectations for everyone involved, from the administrators, coaches and officials to players, parents and spectators. The code of conduct should be informed by the club and sporting organisation's risk assessment and be a tool for the management of specific risks. A code of conduct should be in place for administrators, coaches, officials, players and parents. Such codes outline an agreed standard of behaviour for everyone. Sport Ireland has developed a wide range of policy and procedural templates, including sample codes of conduct, which we encourage organisations to take and tailor to suit the needs of their membership. Further examples of work in the NGB sector include the IRFU’s establishment of a behaviours and discipline working group.

With regard to diversity and inclusion, Sport Ireland is committed to combating racism and all forms of discrimination in sport. As part of our work in the area of diversity and inclusion, the development of guidance, resources, toolkits and training and education initiatives will be cornerstone actions in the implementation of a new Sport Ireland policy on diversity and inclusion in sport, which is due to be published in the coming weeks. Sport Ireland recognises the wider societal, structural and systemic challenges faced by marginalised groups in Ireland today. In acknowledging the contribution of sport, as outlined in the national sports policy, Sport Ireland hopes that policy will be the catalyst to removing barriers and eliminating discrimination in sport. Furthermore, Sport Ireland will continue our extensive co-operation across Departments and agencies by contributing to national policies and strategies focused on promoting inclusion and tackling discrimination.

Through its ongoing engagement with funded bodies, Sport Ireland will continue to encourage the highest standards of governance across all facets of the organisations' operations, including ensuring they have adequate policies, procedures and codes of conduct in place, and that these are augmented by appropriate and robust responses and actions.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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That was brilliant. I invite Ms Mary O'Connor, on behalf of the Federation of Irish Sport, to make her opening statement.

Ms Mary O'Connor:

I thank the Chairperson, Deputies and Senators for inviting the Federation of Irish Sport to make a statement today. For those who may not be familiar with the work of the federation, we are an independent, not-for-profit, representative body of 110 organisations across Ireland, including 81 national governing bodies, NGBs, and 29 local sports partnerships, LSPs. The federation’s statement today will focus on recommendations for consideration by the committee to aid the elimination of any and all abuse directed towards referees, officials and players in sport. For more than a century, sport organisations, from grassroots to elite, have provided an extraordinary platform to teach values, create better societies, teach empathy and improve human rights. Great progress has been made in challenging racism and promoting and creating opportunities for inclusion for under-represented groups, including females, the LGBTI community and ethnic minorities. However, abuse of referees, officials and players has been referenced as sport's ugly blind spot despite these individuals being essential participants in making sport happen.

The Federation of Irish Sport respectfully recommends the following actions on this important topic be considered by the joint committee under the following headings: communications and information, research-training-education, and resources and funding. Those actions include the establishment of a working group of key stakeholders in Irish Sport to develop and design a national code of conduct for Irish Sport as part of a safeguarding and education toolkit; the expansion of action 2.3 of the Sports Action Plan 2021-2023 relating to an information campaign to include the unacceptability of any and all abuse directed towards referees, officials and players in sport; the appointment of campaign ambassadors-role models to reflect a zero tolerance stance on the abuse of referees, officials and players; and to develop a campaign tagline with a core message to use on all internal and external communication tools such as a core message along the lines:

There is no place for abuse in sport in any shape or form - Call it out. Report it. Stop it NOW. Sport is an inclusive community that embraces participants, volunteers and officials. All deserve RESPECT.

Those actions also include that all official NGB-club websites should have a public statement of compliance or a commitment to a charter to a national code of conduct to have easily accessible complaint procedures to report abuse.

The sixth action we recommend is that all NGBs develop and promote a social media policy to be adhered to by all members, including players, coaches, committee members, volunteers and parents, if they have not already done so.

The seventh action is that the provision of training and supports for administrators with regard to the handling of reported abuse should be added as a key performance indicator under action 4.2 of the Sports Action Plan 2021-2023. The eighth action is the provision of a suite of resources to assist referees, officials and players who have been the subject of abuse. The ninth action is the introduction of a requirement for large-scale sport capital infrastructure applications to include evidence of policy and actions that are being undertaken by the applicant on the eradication of abuse directed toward referees, officials and players in sport at both NGB and club level.

The tenth action is the provision of signage at all infrastructure that has received State funding condemning abuse directed towards referees, officials, players and volunteers and the promotion of sport as a safe, enjoyable learning environment for all. An alternative to this action would be the provision of signage at all infrastructure that has received State funding to outline the terms of admission at the entrances to venues and around the venues. Spectators or supporters could argue they are not bound by the rules and regulations of the club or NGB because they are not members. Placing signage detailing the terms of admission around venues may assist clubs and NGBs in arguing that, by remaining at the ground, the spectator or supporter agreed to be bound by those terms of admission. It is obviously not guaranteed to work but it may assist in acting as a deterrent.

I will now discuss online abuse. It was recently announced that the Government has agreed to begin the process of recruiting an online safety commissioner. The federation strongly endorses this decision. The federation also believes that representations should be made suggesting that, in addition to the commissioner drawing up rules on how social media services should deal with harmful online content, online abuse directed at referees, officials and players in sport should be included along with the matters already stated, which include criminal material and so on. The commissioner should also be given the power to appoint authorised officers to conduct investigations of online abuse of referees, officials and players in sport.

The 12th action we recommend is the strengthening of legislative proposals to address online harm including the introduction of a new legal framework for identifying and removing illegal and harmful content from the Internet similar those in the Online Safety Bill formally proposed and now adopted by the UK Government. The 13th action is all media outlets operating in Ireland committing to a public statement of compliance to a national code of conduct on the monitoring and blocking of online abuse in sport.

The Federation of Irish Sport respects the authority of all national governing bodies to govern their organisations and their agreed processes and procedures to deal with the abuse of referees, officials, and players but we believe that an overarching and unifying framework to assist with the elimination of any and all abuse in Irish sport should be considered.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Ms O'Connor for that very comprehensive step-by-step guideline as to how the matter should be addressed.

Mr. Cian ? Lion?in:

Gabhaim míle buíochas leis an gCathaoirleach. I am delighted to be here. I am joined by Micheál Ó Conaire, principal officer with our sports division policy unit. We very much welcome this opportunity to address the committee on this important matter.

It goes without saying that both the Ministers and the Department condemn any form of abuse, including online abuse, discrimination or inappropriate behaviour towards anyone involved in sport. Referees, all other officials, whether on the field or off of it, and players are integral building blocks of our sporting structure and deserve to be respected for the important role they play in sport. Abuse of officials or players at any level is plain wrong and should not be tolerated. Everybody involved in sport deserves to be treated with respect and should not feel unsafe or threatened while they are officiating or participating at games. This applies not just to sport, but to wider society. While sport has, for example, already played an important role in calling out racist behaviour, there is still much to do both in sport and in society in general. In that context, the Department of Justice is working to legislate for hate crime and hate speech as a priority to ensure that Ireland is a safe and secure place for all. This legislation will apply to offences committed where the victim is targeted because of their association in the mind of the perpetrator with a particular identity characteristic such as sexual orientation or ethnicity.

The corrosive impact of personalised abuse of participants in sport is well recognised. A large number of referees and officials are volunteers, and it is appreciated that, without them, most sports could not operate as well as they do or, indeed, survive. It is important that sports organisations across all sports provide a safe environment for referees, officials and players. Where abuse and threatening behaviour is aimed at them, appropriate action must be taken by those bodies. Each of the youth field sports promotes respect programmes. Where abuse does occur, sporting national governing bodies are asked to use the key disciplinary procedures and sanctions that exist within their organisations to ensure that those responsible are held to account.

As Dr. May has already said, codes of conduct are a vital tool in combating the scourge of abuse. They set a standard of behaviour that helps build a club or sport organisation’s culture and make it easier to deal with conduct and behaviour issues as they arise. Sport Ireland helps NGBs in the development of these critical codes.

The National Sports Policy 2018-2027 promotes inclusion with a focus on addressing social, disability, gender, ethnic and other gradients. The sports action plan launched at the end of 2021 includes a number of actions to address inequalities in these areas. Sport Ireland has also been working hard in this area and has developed a policy on diversity and inclusion in sport which we hope will be published in the coming weeks.

Irish society is increasingly multicultural, and sport has a vital role to play in terms of social inclusion, integration and equal opportunities. While sport has made significant strides in tackling racism, continued vigilance is required. The programme for Government is clear on this and states that the Government is committed to adopting a zero-tolerance approach to racism in amateur and professional sport. Sport Ireland has funded various anti-discrimination initiatives from the NGBs and local sports partnerships. The promotion of inclusion and integration through sport is an important feature of national sports policy, which is delivered in particular by considerable investment from the Dormant Accounts Fund to support the development and implementation of inclusive sport policies and programmes. Both of our Ministers and the Department will continue to work on combatting racism and discrimination in partnership with Sport Ireland, the NGBs and colleagues across other Departments.

As Ms O'Connor stated, online abuse towards those involved in sport in an issue of increasing concern and reflects developments in wider society. The Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, is making considerable progress towards the enactment of the Online Safety and Media Regulation Bill 2022. A significant recent development in this area was the introduction of the Harassment, Harmful Communications and Related Offences Act 2020, or Coco’s Law. Introduced by the Minister for Justice, this has helped to reform and strengthen Irish laws pertaining to criminal harassment, image-based abuse and malicious communications.

The Minister introduced the Online Safety and Media Regulation Bill, which is currently on Committee Stage in the Seanad. This will, inter alia, establish a multi-person coimisiún na meán, enable the appointment of an online safety commissioner and provide for the introduction of a regulatory framework for online safety. The commissioner will oversee the regulatory framework and devise binding online safety codes setting out how regulated online platforms, including social media platforms, will be required to tackle the availability of certain defined categories of harmful online content. In particular, on the basis of Coco’s Law, online content by which a person distributes or publishes a threatening or grossly offensive communication about another person or sends a threatening or grossly offensive communication to another person will be considered harmful online content. The risk-based and systemic regulatory approach set out in the Bill will ensure that we are all, across all sectors, exposed to far less harmful online content and provide for an environment in which online services have to respond to and robustly deal with complaints when they are made.

The Department will continue to work closely with Sport Ireland, the NGBs and other stakeholders, both in Ireland and overseas, to ensure respect for everyone involved in sport. In that context, it is noteworthy that under the current EU work plan for sport, which runs to June 2024, there is likely to be a policy debate in 2023 on the topic of ensuring a safe environment in sport. We will strongly support the holding of that debate as the sharing of lessons and experiences, such as we are seeing today, is a vital input to the ongoing battle against the scourge of abuse in sport.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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I thank all of the witnesses for their comprehensive statements. It is apt that we are working on that Online Safety and Media Regulation Bill. Unfortunately, online services have allowed what happens on the side of the playing field to continue off the pitch. I hope that we will be able to address that further down the road. I will now call on my colleagues, who will have a number of questions lined up. I remind colleagues that they each have a five-minute slot to include both questions and answers. I hope they are aware of their place in the rota. Deputy Christopher O'Sullivan has the first slot. He has five minutes.

Photo of Christopher O'SullivanChristopher O'Sullivan (Cork South West, Fianna Fail)
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I am going to pass on the opportunity to take my slot at this point because I was in the Dáil Chamber and missed the opening statements. Perhaps I could come back in when I have had a chance to scan the opening statements and listen to some of the discussion.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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That is perfect. I apologise to Deputy Mythen. I do not know how I skipped over his name while he was looking at me from the screen. He is actually the first speaker.

Photo of Johnny MythenJohnny Mythen (Wexford, Sinn Fein)
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I thank the Cathaoirleach. I thank the witnesses very much for attending. Is there a timeline for the publication of the diversity and inclusion policy?

Dr. Una May:

The policy is currently being printed. We hope to publish it in the very near future. It is really just a matter of timing. It has gone to the printers so we expect it in the next few weeks.

Photo of Johnny MythenJohnny Mythen (Wexford, Sinn Fein)
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Can Dr. May be more specific about the timeline?

Dr. Una May:

We hope we might be able to publish it on 20 May, but that is subject to the final arrangements for the process by which it will be launched. There is significant interest from both Ministers in this area and both are anxious to be involved. It will, I suppose, be determined by the availability of both the Ministers.

Photo of Johnny MythenJohnny Mythen (Wexford, Sinn Fein)
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Sport Ireland indicated in its report that it would favour a centralised sports ombudsman. How would that help?

Dr. Una May:

There is no reference to an ombudsman in Sport Ireland’s submission. The Department mentioned a commissioner in its submission, which might be the reference the Deputy meant.

Photo of Johnny MythenJohnny Mythen (Wexford, Sinn Fein)
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All right, I apologise for the confusion. Turning to the federation, our guests spoke about how there is not much policing of fans at the grounds. For ticketed events, could a code of conduct be printed on the ticket that would legally oblige persons attending to obey it? Could that help?

Ms Mary O'Connor:

I am not an expert on the legal aspect of ticketing, but it is a valuable suggestion and that is what this meeting is about. It is about stimulating conversation. For many people in Irish sport, these are difficult conversations to have because sport is such a popular and emotive topic, and sometimes people try to excuse the abuse. We are trying to say abuse is inexcusable and take a zero-tolerance approach, and we want to find the best ways we can to eliminate it. We believe that, along with ticketing, there should be an overarching campaign for all the sporting bodies because in recent years in Ireland, different NGBs have run their own campaigns regarding abuse and so on. We believe an overarching campaign to bring together the entire sports sector would be a better use of people's expertise.

Photo of Johnny MythenJohnny Mythen (Wexford, Sinn Fein)
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As another suggestion, at semi-finals, finals and so on, could an independent official be appointed at the ground to work with the referee, whereby if an incident happens, it will not be just the referee who will deal with it? Currently, almost everything is based on the referee's report. If there were someone independent who could see what was going on, he or she could report on the incident as well.

Ms Mary O'Connor:

A plethora of sports are played in this country and most of them have referees, officials or judges, and in my experience, abuse happens in different formats. The issue goes back to the national governing bodies of sport, which are well versed in their own rules and procedures as to how they could monitor that work. Again, it is a valuable suggestion.

Photo of Johnny MythenJohnny Mythen (Wexford, Sinn Fein)
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What is the position on the use of video evidence?

Ms Mary O'Connor:

Again, many of the national governing bodies would have that in their rules as admissible in certain incidents. That goes back to the individual organisations and their own rules and processes. The Federation of Irish Sport has no influence on that.

Photo of Johnny MythenJohnny Mythen (Wexford, Sinn Fein)
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Does the Department monitor or research abuse in sport? Does it collect data in that regard, such as trends or reports? Has any research been carried out into drugs in sport? The abuse of drugs is an issue, especially on weekends, and that can be reflected on the field in certain sports and towards referees.

Mr. Cian ? Lion?in:

Sport Ireland has a well-developed research team that monitors performance across a range of sports and NGBs. We are fortunate to have a strong authority on anti-doping and Dr. May has strong experience on that. Without wishing to pass the rugby ball, so to speak, I think she might wish to comment.

Dr. Una May:

The national anti-doping programme relates specifically to substances that are abused for performance-enhancing purposes, but it also incorporates what might be referred to as recreational drugs. The programme tests athletes for the use of other substances apart from those that are traditionally considered to be performance enhancing, and we monitor the issue from that point of view. We do carry out research, but we have not dedicated a specific module of our research to it. Every year, we have a number of so-called flexible modules in which we ask new questions every time. The issue is certainly something we could look into in greater depth. I am aware it has been raised a few times recently, so we would be happy to incorporate it into the research outside of performance-enhancing drugs.

Photo of Christopher O'SullivanChristopher O'Sullivan (Cork South West, Fianna Fail)
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It would be remiss of me not to congratulate Dr. May and to wish her the best of luck in her role. I look forward very much to working with her. The previous chief executive was always very forthcoming in appearing before the committee and I hope that will be the case with her. I am sure she will excel in the role.

On abuse in sport, whether online or in person, we have heard some evidence from referees who described some harrowing experiences they have had. It is difficult to go into detail on this in a five-minute presentation. My question is for whoever wishes to take it, although I acknowledge it is difficult for our guests, as representatives of various sporting bodies, to point the finger at any specific sports. Is there any evidence to suggest the level of abuse and aggravation is higher in certain sports? It is safe to say women, and female politicians in particular, are subject to more online abuse than their male counterparts. Is there any evidence to suggest that is the case in sports?

Any of us who has attended certain sporting events will have witnessed the sideline abuse, the hurler on the ditch, as we call them, and the aggravation. Despicable and disgusting language is often hurled, whether at the coach or the player wearing the jersey who is doing his or her best to represent the team. Is it realistic to think we can curb that aggression and aggravation with measures, strategies or legislation, or is it something sport will just have to live with?

Our guests might touch on the Online Safety and Media Regulation Bill and how they feel that is progressing in addressing the abuse we have all seen aimed at, in some instances, some very high-profile sportspeople by these anonymous trolls and keyboard warriors who level all sorts of disgusting language at these people who are just trying to do their best?

Dr. Una May:

I am happy to refer to the question about female officials, referees and coaches in sport. We have been doing extensive work in the area of women in sport, including a number of surveys. We are currently carrying out a survey in respect of officiating in sport for women, and we have previously conducted research into coaches and the barriers to coaching for women in sport. Sexist abuse has been identified, although perhaps not specifically spelled out. Generally, the commentary we would associate with the issues in this area has been identified as a problem for women in sport in coaching roles, and we have developed a women in sport coaching toolkit that clearly identifies a significant number of recommendations to help and support women to retain, encourage, promote and introduce more women into coaching roles in sport.

With regard to the sideline abuse, our big focus at the moment in Sport Ireland is around good governance. While we have a very important emphasis on governance in sport and developing governance structures, we have identified that governance alone and new structures, policies and procedures alone do not necessarily effect change on their own. It requires a change in culture and that is where this comes in. There are a number of initiatives around sideline culture and respect. We have a parents in sport week, which focuses on parents' behaviour sometimes on the sidelines, the silent sidelines initiative and a number of other initiatives like that which target specific behaviours. A culture shift is required, and it requires everybody to know his or her role in sport. That includes parents and other coaches so that the coach is not trying to be the referee and everybody has a clear understanding of their role within the sport.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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Does Mr. Ó Lionáin wish to come in?

Mr. Cian ? Lion?in:

To come back to the Deputy on the issue of sideline behaviour, as I said in my remarks, it is a reflection of wider society. What happens on the sidelines is not unique. It must be considered as part of the wider societal context. Colleagues in the Department of Justice, for instance, are looking at how we speak to each other and whether abuse becomes so abusive that it is verging on a hate crime. These are areas of policy at which the Department of Justice is looking. I am not sure what the threshold would be in that regard but what happens in sport reflects wider society. The responsibility then from a sports perspective is on the sports national governing bodies, NGB, to deliver training and coaching to their units and organisations on the standards expected. Some are better than others in that regard.

On the issue of the Online Safety and Media Regulation Bill 2022, I know a number of further sessions are scheduled on Committee Stage. A critical part there will be trying to have meaningful regulation of online platforms which are, unfortunately, where an awful lot of sport and wider societal abuse is now delivered. I am not an expert in these areas; colleagues are leading on it. However, we see that as a critical measure to try to get a handle on and turn back the tide of bile that can be directed at sportspeople and others online.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Mr Ó Lionáin. I am going to have to draw this to a close. I thank Deputy Christopher O'Sullivan for that line of questioning. I am now moving to Senator Carrigy. The floor is his.

Photo of Micheál CarrigyMicheál Carrigy (Fine Gael)
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I thank the Chairman very much. I apologise for being late. The witnesses are very welcome. I also wish Dr. May well in her new role.

Apologies if this has already been mentioned but the witnesses spoke about codes of conduct within the national governing bodies across all sports. If any NGB or sporting body does not take on board these codes of conduct, do the witnesses think their funding from Government should be affected?

I have another question on the Online Safety and Media Regulation Bill 2022, which was mentioned. I tabled an amendment that would allow the Media Commission to discuss the issues, with wording to the effect that all sporting organisations under the Federation of Irish Sport would insert this Bill into their codes of conduct across all sports. This would give more governance to people in that each of the organisations would themselves discipline people if they breached it apart from it being done legally. That wording was not accepted, however, and we are going back to look again at maybe using wording like Sport Ireland that will encompass all sports across the country.

Dr. May mentioned disputes in her introduction, and we have Sport Dispute Solutions Ireland. I will speak specifically to a recent case with which we are all fairly familiar and which needs to be looked at. We recently had a case where a number of people were suspended by an organisation and were advised to go to Sport Dispute Solutions Ireland. They won their case yet the costs have gone against them. These are individuals who give hundreds of hours and, indeed, hundreds of years' voluntary contribution to the sport, and this is what they have been left with for defending their names after having been suspended. They now have to foot the legal costs for defending themselves and they were found to have been incorrectly suspended. I do not think that is acceptable.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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Who would the Senator like to respond to his questions and observations?

Photo of Micheál CarrigyMicheál Carrigy (Fine Gael)
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Sports Ireland may respond on the code of conduct. The Federation of Irish Sport can respond on the sports dispute resolution as it comes under its remit.

Dr. Una May:

First and foremost, I will be very clear on our policy and philosophy. Although I am a new CEO in the role, I would maintain the philosophy we have always had, which is that we do not use the stick of funding for every area we would like to tackle when we feel there is an injustice or difficulty within a sport. We have always taken the approach, which I will continue to do, that we are a development agency. We are there to support, guide and nurture the organisations to develop good practice rather than punish when poor practice emerges.

We provide many templates around codes of conduct, specifically with regard to safeguarding young people, and those codes of conduct overlap into all areas, really. We provide templates for codes of conduct for parents, children and coaches. It is for all the people involved in the running and organisation of sport as well as the participants.

In providing those solutions and reviewing the safeguarding processes we manage, safeguarding is one of the very small number of areas in which we have a very strong link with our funding. Safeguarding is absolutely critical to ensure that our sports are safe for our young children. It is an area that is linked with funding. We are currently in the process of carrying out a club audit around the implementation of safeguarding regulations. The challenge is, of course, that we are talking about many thousands of clubs, and it is at a club level that we need to ensure these are implemented. While we can have codes of conduct at the highest level and all the supports we provide around our governance tools, it is at the club level that this is critical. That is where I would see the code of conduct issue.

I will give Ms O'Connor a chance to respond on the other question.

Ms Mary O'Connor:

Sport Dispute Solutions Ireland is a service the Federation of Irish Sport provides. It is a panel of highly-qualified arbitrators and mediators. Sport Dispute Solutions Ireland is, however, a confidential legal process and we do not comment on individual cases.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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Okay. Is Senator Carrigy satisfied? He has a little bit more time.

Photo of Micheál CarrigyMicheál Carrigy (Fine Gael)
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I can understand the answer in that regard but if we are to have an independent robust mechanism for disputes, I do not think it is fair that someone could be left with the cost of defending himself or herself, no matter what sport or event it is. I do not think that is correct and it needs to be looked at.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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Okay. I thank Senator Carrigy very much. I will move now to Deputy Fitzpatrick. The floor is his.

Photo of Peter FitzpatrickPeter Fitzpatrick (Louth, Independent)
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I welcome all the witnesses today. I congratulate Dr. May on her position. Mr. John Treacy has been good to us for the last number of years and I am sure she will be the same.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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No pressure.

Photo of Peter FitzpatrickPeter Fitzpatrick (Louth, Independent)
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Dr. May mentioned earlier in her statement that "volunteering in sport needs to remain an attractive position". I agree 100% with her because if we look at sport nowadays, and especially the number of women getting involved in teen sports, we can see the Irish soccer, rugby and GAA teams all doing very well. I have been involved with sport all my life. At present, I am chairman of the Louth GAA county board so I am involved with a lot of sport.

The issue at the moment is that every sporting organisation is finding it very hard to get officials. When I say officials I mean referees and coaches. It is about trying to get people to come and give a hand because the word is "volunteers". These people come along and, to be honest, I noticed in the last number of years that the abuse they are receiving is getting increasingly worse. The thing is, we need protection. In her statement, Dr. May mentioned training and supports for these people. Is there any kind of accountability with the money Sport Ireland is giving to the sporting organisations? What I mean by that is Sport Ireland is giving money to these organisations, but is the money going to look after the officials and coaches who are doing this voluntary work at the moment? Is there any kind of accountability for that? It is very important that there is some way of tracking the money, which is a lot, that Sport Ireland gives to these organisations.

Dr. May mentioned that Sport Ireland does not really get involved in the complaints and that it kind of lets the organisations look after themselves. We are talking about the GAA with referees, rugby with the spirit of the law and a group organisation with soccer. What I am trying to say is that accountability must be there. I know myself that as a parent and grandparent, I want to be sure that when my son or daughter goes out there, they are getting the best protection. In fairness, Mr. Ó Lionáin and Ms O'Connor made the point about social media but I do not care what anybody says - social media and online abuse have a free run. I know they mentioned the Minister doing this and that at the moment but nothing is being done. Parents ring me on a daily basis about the abuse they are getting in the newspapers and about the referees.

Something has to be done. Ireland is a sporting nation and it is great to see everything going well. I agree with Ms O'Connor, who stated that the abuse of referees was an ugly blind spot. People believe that money can fix the situation. It helps, but it does not fix it. We have no systems in place. I come from a GAA background, but I am sure that the situation is the same elsewhere. We need people to feel like they are wanted and that their money is going to the right places.

I do not agree with the comments about social media. The situation is getting worse. Someone might say that A, B and C is being done, but it is not. There are elite sports people who are probably getting more attention than the normal person who plays with his or her club and community. What are the organisations before us doing to distribute money and look after referees and other officials? Will they tell me so that I can go home and tell my children and grandchildren that something is being done and that the abuse in the sporting environment will not carry on when they go to work or school the next morning and they can enjoy a normal day without seeing it online or in newspapers? That is the main issue. What are the three organisations doing to help?

Ms Mary O'Connor:

I will address the volunteerism aspect first. The Federation of Irish Sport, in association with University College Cork and with funding from Sport Ireland, is examining succession planning in volunteering. We have a concern about succession planning, including in the examples the Deputy cited. We hope that this research will help us to implement actions.

Volunteerism has been in Irish sport for centuries and we need to maintain it, but there are additional stresses on volunteers now. One issue is the abuse of volunteers – not just referees, other officials or players, but volunteers in volunteer roles at club level. We need to examine this issue, and I hope that the research will address it.

Dr. Una May:

We are in the process of developing a volunteer strategy to try to identify and address a number of the issues that have been raised, not only concerning abuse, but retention and promotion as well. As we have recovered and come out the other end of the pandemic, we have seen significant impacts on volunteering levels in some sports. We are trying to put a focus on encouraging, promoting and retaining our current volunteers by ensuring that they are well looked after through, for example, the awards that the federation provides and a number of other initiatives where we encourage and support the development of good practice in volunteering. There are a number of sports where we provide funding for the likes of development officers, who work alongside the volunteers. It is important that we manage that relationship between professionals and volunteers and support volunteers as much as we can.

Mr. Cian ? Lion?in:

The Online Safety and Media Regulation Bill is being developed by the Department precisely because people are not happy with what is happening online. That is why an online safety commissioner is needed and there will be a clear regulatory framework for online safety. I am not sure where the situation will go after that, but those tools will need to be in place, which is a major priority for the Department.

Photo of Peter FitzpatrickPeter Fitzpatrick (Louth, Independent)
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It is important that we protect those who participate in sport. Sport is great for people’s mental health and everything else. A great deal of money is being given to organisations, and I hope that some of it is being used to look after the officials, coaches and people involved in sport.

I thank the witnesses for attending.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Deputy Fitzpatrick for his line of questioning. I will now call Senator Cassells, who has been awaiting his speaking slot eagerly.

Photo of Shane CassellsShane Cassells (Fianna Fail)
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I will start by asking questions as they come to me. This debate has progressed since last year, which is the most welcome aspect. It is not the case that, after people came in and made statements, we moved on and waited another five years before touching the issue again. I praise Ms O’Connor in particular for attending this meeting with a series of objectives and asking the committee to adopt them. I propose that we adopt them and that we work with the Department, whose officials are present, and the Minister to see them implemented. This is the first time that witnesses have returned, told us that they have done their homework and shown us what they wanted us to do. There is no point in us using flowery language, patting people on the head, sending them out the door and doing nothing. Ms O’Connor has come to this meeting, taken the issue seriously and set out a series of objectives for us to achieve. We can tie them in to projects that have received State funding, and that should be implemented. I propose that we do so. In February, €150 million was given out to 1,900 clubs. Each of those clubs should be adhering to the code of conduct being requested by the head of the Federation of Irish Sport. That is the bartering tool – if they sign up to the code, they must adhere to it and abusers must be ejected from grounds. Is the Department willing to accept Ms O’Connor’s proposals and work with the federation to see the signage implemented?

Mr. Cian ? Lion?in:

After every round of sports capital funding, we conduct a full review and see what the lessons are. Last time around, we introduced a sustainability element to funding. In the context of such a review, we can examine the proposals that Ms O’Connor has outlined and see what we can tie into future sports funding.

Photo of Shane CassellsShane Cassells (Fianna Fail)
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That is welcome. Given that we are all sitting in this room today and the proposition has been formally made to the committee in writing, I propose that we accept it. Can we consider this element as a way of promoting respectful behaviour within our sports clubs?

Mr. Cian ? Lion?in:

As part of the review of the outgoing programme and getting ready for the next programme, we can commit to examining those recommendations and seeing how they can fit in and whether they can work well. We will take that suggestion on board.

Photo of Shane CassellsShane Cassells (Fianna Fail)
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In her propositions, Ms O’Connor spoke about signage and large-scale infrastructure. I presume she meant at all clubs that were receiving funding.

Ms Mary O'Connor:

Absolutely. We need to get the message out there that there is zero tolerance and that there is a responsibility on individuals to act appropriately regardless of whether they are at an under-sixes parish league match or an inter-county game. This is a human interest story. The impact of abuse has devastating consequences, not just for the individuals concerned, but for their families and friends as well. We have an opportunity to address this issue in a meaningful way.

I welcome the opportunity to appear before the committee. The Federation of Irish Sport works collaboratively with Sport Ireland and the Department. We want everyone to work towards a solution.

Photo of Shane CassellsShane Cassells (Fianna Fail)
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Dr. May spoke about a cultural shift. She was 100% correct. I praise the LGFA. I sit on its national development committee. We held a meeting in Croke Park last week. One of the LGFA’s initiatives is to increase female participation in refereeing, including by introducing junior whistlers. Brave lads on the sideline are not as brave if they are abusing a 14-year-old girl. One might think that that was the point we made. I ended up being an umpire at my girl’s under-13s match a couple of weeks ago. The umpire on the other side, who was a guy from the other club, started abusing the referee. I told him to shut his trap or he was gone. The cultural shift is still not permeating among certain people. However, I praise the LGFA for its efforts.

Mr. Ó Lionáin referenced the Online Safety and Media Regulation Bill in the context of meaningful change. Will the Department accept some of the amendments that Senators Malcolm Byrne, Carrigy and I are tabling to ensure that meaningful change happens? We have tabled amendments to reflect Government policy in what he has just spoke about in terms of abuse in sport. Language is being used in this room but it is not being reflected in Government policy. Following on from comments by Mr. Larry McCarthy, uachtarán of Cumann Lúthcleas Gael, Senator Carrigy tabled amendments relating to amateur sports people. Would the Department be open to Ms O’Connor’s proposals for meaningful change?

Mr. Cian ? Lion?in:

I will bring those points back to my colleagues who are working on the Bill. Regarding Senator Carrigy’s point about the Federation of Irish Sport, I believe that it was not negative but was instead about trying to ensure the Bill was as broad as possible.

Photo of Shane CassellsShane Cassells (Fianna Fail)
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I wish to ask Dr. May a question on the cultural change. I had always held the IRFU up as a shining light because it tried to engender respect among young people growing up. Surprisingly, when we held this session last year, the IRFU was dealing with one of the largest levels of complaints. Maybe it just has a more open system. What are Dr. May’s views? Is there progress in the cultural shift among the sporting bodies she is representing?

Dr. Una May:

Some of them have taken it seriously. The committee received submissions from them. The IRFU is a good example, as it has taken the matter seriously. Its Spirit of Rugby Charter is a powerful example. In terms of funding for coaches, referees, other officials and so on, it is difficult to direct specific funding down to that level within an NGB.

What they have done is invest in Spirit of Rugby officials in all the provinces. That is a very good example of how you can, slowly but surely. Their initiative incorporates the sort of signage Ms O'Connor was alluding to around respect on the pitch, at the event and at the venue, so it covers everything from player behaviour through to anyone who walks through the gate being expected to adhere to the basic, fundamental behaviours, especially around respect.

Photo of Shane CassellsShane Cassells (Fianna Fail)
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I thank Dr. May. I am finished, a Chathaoirligh, but I formally propose the recommendations made by Ms O'Connor. We should also send that to the Minister of State, Deputy Chambers, and the Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin. I acknowledge what Mr. Ó Lionáin is saying on behalf of the Department and thank him for that. I think we can still do that in this term. As we speak, the clubs are drawing down their money from the allocations made in February. There is nothing precluding a scenario where we could see signage put on 1,900 clubs throughout this country supporting respect for referees.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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I am informed that will be incorporated into the report we will be doing on this and forwarded to the Minister as well. Is that agreed? I think there is unanimity on that proposal from Senator Cassells and I thank him.

Photo of Alan DillonAlan Dillon (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I welcome our guests and thank the secretariat for the briefing notes. I am grateful to the Federation of Irish Sport, Sport Ireland and the Department for submitting some important documents. I second what Senator Carrigy said. The recommendations from the federation are very strong and I thank Ms O'Connor for her work in this area.

My first question is for her. It is on the establishment of a working group of key stakeholders in Irish sport. Will she give us a sense of what she is talking about there and what that would be comprised of?

Ms Mary O'Connor:

There is value in having a working group of key stakeholders. I call it a working group because sometimes things can get lost in translation and a working group will have key timelines and so on. The key stakeholders would include a plethora of very important people in Irish sport, including Sport Ireland Coaching from that side of the house, supporters groups, media representatives and academia.

It is important we look at that in the context of what we want to try to achieve in Irish sport. As I alluded to earlier, very many national governing bodies are doing great work individually in trying to eradicate abuse from their sports. This working group could come up with a safeguarding and education toolkit but could also develop into a campaign we are all part of. Previous campaigns the federation was involved in, like the 20x20 campaign, had a huge impact on the growth of women and girls' sport in this country because people could connect with it and understand it. I do not think there is anybody involved in sport at any level who would not have witnessed or been involved in abuse at some level. By creating a stakeholder group of that size. you will get an understanding of what the challenges are and what the opportunities are as well, because we have to face challenges. There are difficult conversations. There are some people out there who do not think this is a problem. They think it is all part of sport. Unfortunately, they are the people we probably need to challenge the most and let them challenge us back, but we need to have a very frank conversation on this.

Photo of Alan DillonAlan Dillon (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I thank Ms O'Connor. Turning to Mr. Ó Lionáin, can we expand the Sports Action Plan 2021-2023 to include the issues around abuse of referees, officials and volunteers? What is currently within that action plan that gives us provision to ensure we focus on this and we are working towards alleviating it?

Mr. Cian ? Lion?in:

I want to let Mr. Ó Conaire come in on this.

Mr. Miche?l ? Conaire:

I thank Mr. Ó Lionáin. As Ms O'Connor alluded to earlier, there is a specific action within the action plan that highlights the work undertaken by other Departments, including those with responsibility for justice, children-----

Photo of Alan DillonAlan Dillon (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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What was done in the officials' Department specifically?

Mr. Miche?l ? Conaire:

The idea is we would look to work with those Departments to do an information campaign based around highlighting a lot of the unacceptability of stuff we have talked about today like racism, abuse, homophobia and any type of discrimination in sport. That is something that is in the work plan of the Department for the next year or so.

Photo of Alan DillonAlan Dillon (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Has a budget been allocated to that yet or when does Mr. Ó Conaire think that would be implemented? Is there a timeline around that?

Mr. Miche?l ? Conaire:

There is not a timeline on it at present. As I said, the sports action plan was launched in November of last year and there are 43 actions within that. We are working through a timeframe on many of them at moment. Some of them are already under way and others are getting off the ground as we speak. Some others have not begun yet. That falls into the third category but it is something that is on the Department's radar. We will certainly take on board the recommendations Ms O'Connor has brought forward today and take them up with the federation prior to commencing that action.

Photo of Alan DillonAlan Dillon (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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We appreciate that. Turning to Dr. May, I raise the Sport Ireland criteria for recognition. She said in her opening statement all applicant bodies must satisfy Sport Ireland they have a formal disciplinary policy. Does Sport Ireland review that policy in terms of how it is implemented? If a body does not have such a policy, what repercussions are there or what does Sport Ireland do to ensure this is in place?

Dr. Una May:

The reality is we do not have an issue with anybody who does not have a policy in place. The fact they have access to the sports dispute resolution mechanism of the federation ensures, even for the smaller governing bodies that might not have the supports and the infrastructure from a point of view of management of the organisation, if it is a small volunteer organisation, that they do not need to have access to a full disciplinary process of their own and can adopt the process that has been provided to them. That ensures this is not a challenge for us. Access to disciplinary procedures is not something we have never had an issue with, to be honest. We have made reference to anti-doping. We have specific disciplinary procedures around areas where there is a requirement and, clearly, there are areas around safeguarding that are forwarded to the appropriate authorities. There are, therefore, different mechanisms around these areas of discipline and behaviours within sport.

Photo of Alan DillonAlan Dillon (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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On that, and this is my final point, we receive submissions from various sporting organisations. Some of them have suggested the establishment of a centralised sporting ombudsman, the function of which would be to handle abuse reports across the board. We have heard from various witnesses who have come before us that there is a major issue with the under-reporting of incidents. There is much fear around what they are do to in this instance. What would be Sport Ireland's take on establishing this type of position? Would it support something along those lines being established?

Dr. Una May:

It is an area that overlaps into the whole concept of whistleblowing, and that is an other area altogether that is addressed through other legislation. Each individual NGB has its own systems and they have reporting systems in place. Many of them have their own quite sophisticated systems for reporting. Others are more basic. Having a centralised system would assume the issues were all going to be consistent and that we could address them in the same way across all sports. The reality is the types of issues are very diverse and the organisations in which we work are very diverse. We are talking about a comparison between the ability of a small, volunteer-led organisation to address an issue and that of a significantly larger organisation. It is that level of consistency across organisations that would make it very difficult to have an overseeing ombudsman, as such.

Photo of Malcolm ByrneMalcolm Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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I thank all our guests. I join members in congratulating Dr. May on her role and wish her the best. It is important in this discussion to acknowledge the good work that is being done and that many of the NGBs are trying their best. The IRFU was mentioned as an example, but I think about some of the smaller codes. Cricket Ireland has done enormous amounts about inclusivity. That all needs to be recognised.

We need that very clear message going out that racism, sexism and homophobia have no place in sport. I know from everybody here and with the NGBs that is a message that is going out there, but unfortunately it is not getting through fully. The difficulty is the impact that has. That impact is felt by individuals on their own well-being and mental health but it also discourages people from continuing to participate in sport. I am conscious there was an Australian study that showed - some colleagues picked up on this earlier - females who are involved in sport are three times more likely to receive online abuse in particular.

That contributes to discouraging young women from getting involved in sport. I am also conscious of professional players who have bravely spoken about the abuse they have experienced and the impact it has had. They are not willing to face work. If they had a bad game on the weekend it is difficult for them to face work on the Monday. That has serious consequences for the individual but also for young people considering taking on a sport professionally, or even just as a hobby.

I am struck by some of the work being done by Australia's eSafety Commissioner with a number of sporting organisations in that country. We have engaged with the commissioner here. They are looking at machine-learning devices to shield players from some of the abuse they receive. They are going to use AI to do that. Some technology solutions may need to be explored. I fully support the suggestions made by the Federation of Irish Sport, and I second Senator Cassell's proposal to adopt the recommendations. Has the Federation of Irish Sport engaged with the social media companies? If so, what has their response been? Is Ms O'Connor satisfied that the likes of Twitter and Facebook are taking this issue sufficiently seriously?

Ms Mary O'Connor:

That is not something we have taken on ourselves or directly taken responsibility for. We are willing to be part of this but there is a capacity issue with the federation. We have a staff of three and our priorities lie with our members and looking after them. This is not something that has come to us previously.

Photo of Malcolm ByrneMalcolm Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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Maybe I should phrase it differently. Does Ms O'Connor believe that social media companies are taking the issue of online abuse sufficiently seriously?

Ms Mary O'Connor:

No. This could be a naive comment but it is my own personal opinion. There needs to be a verification process for these platforms if people are going to be making those kinds of statements. If an individual feels they are right to make these statements, they should get some kind of a warning when they are about to press send regarding what the consequences will be if they do it. I read recently that social media companies are trying to assist and support Deputies who have been receiving abuse. That could be widened to the sports sector. Some individuals might bet on a certain sport and if I make a mistake as a sportsperson, I will get abuse because of that. That is the seriousness of the situation. It is difficult being a high-profile sports star on social media but it is also difficult being a local under-10 at a parish league game getting abuse. It is not nice out there at the moment.

Photo of Malcolm ByrneMalcolm Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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That reflects our experience in talking to people. The social media companies are not taking this issue, or the issue of online abuse in general, sufficiently seriously. That brings me to the Online Safety and Media Regulation Bill 2022, which is before us in the Seanad. We have concerns that the Department is not taking this issue sufficiently seriously. Mr. Ó Lionáin is hearing the concerns here on the sport side. He needs to talk to his colleagues on the media side. Only one amendment, a very minor technical one, has been accepted so far by the Department. If we are to be serious about addressing the question of online abuse, in sport as well as other areas, we need a strong and well-resourced regulator with the effective powers to be able to tackle this problem. It is important that the Department reflect the concerns expressed by the Federation of Irish Sport, the NGBs, the individual players at amateur and professional level and colleagues around this table. Frankly, we do not believe those concerns are being heard by the Department.

Mr. Cian ? Lion?in:

That is a point well made. I will go back and engage with colleagues who are working on this Bill to ensure that is reflected.

Photo of Malcolm ByrneMalcolm Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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I appreciate that Mr. Ó Lionáin cannot speak for the Department, but we cannot have one section of the Department operating in a space where it is not listening to the concerns being expressed by NGBs, the Federation of Irish Sport, sports stars and ordinary volunteers. We have heard from Ms O'Connor that the social media companies are not responding to this problem. I cannot speak for all my colleagues but I think we all share the view that those concerns are not being reflected in the legislation.

Mr. Cian ? Lion?in:

The point is taken. I will engage with colleagues and make sure the sports filter is applied to the work they are doing.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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I thank all the witnesses for their presentations and for answering all the questions and observations from my colleagues. I thank Ms O'Connor for the very pragmatic and practical template she has brought to us. It is more than a template; these are guidelines we can apply and they are very useful. I wanted to tease out recommendation 6 a little. I do not expect Ms O'Connor to have all the answers on this but I want to know what her vision is. The Federation of Irish Sport recommends that NGBs "develop and promote social media policy to be adhered to by all members including players, coaches, [committees and so on]". Imagine a person sees something being done at the parish game, or in one of the elite sports, and they can identify the person doing it as someone who is attached to the club. Where does Ms O'Connor see the responsibility for, or monitoring of, area this within organisations? Maybe that is too much detail to ask but I just want to know what the overall vision is.

Ms Mary O'Connor:

It is about these individuals being aware of their responsibilities. If they are a member of a club or an NGB and they see something on social media, they should not repeat or share it because that would be endorsing bad behaviours and so on. The Olympic Federation of Ireland had a campaign last year called Don't Scroll By. If these individuals see something, they should call it out. That is important as well. For example, if I was in Mr. Gash's club and I saw him producing inappropriate behaviour, I would have to hold him to account. Recommendation 6 relates to the social media policies around how we portray ourselves as sports organisations, as well as how our club PROs portray the sport and the organisation. Sometimes on social media platforms you will see a club PRO making fault at a referee's decision, a coach's decision or a player's decision. We believe they should refrain from doing that because that is all part of the abuse. It is a passive-aggressive style but it has an impact. If you go on Twitter after high-profile GAA games, you can see that one player is always singled out and people-----

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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Pile on.

Ms Mary O'Connor:

Yes. That has to have an effect because if that player is not reading it, you can be sure their family is. That policy is more about our behaviours and making a commitment to behave in a certain way on social media if someone is a member of these organisations.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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We know from previous hearings that the drop-off for young girls in sport can happen around 14, 15 or 16 years. Do the witnesses have any idea or sense of the impact social media has in this regard? Is that any part of the reason for that fall-off, particularly for young girls?

Ms Mary O'Connor:

It has an impact, both directly and indirectly. It has a direct impact in that they would read social media after games but it also affects them in the belief that they should have to look a certain way and have a certain image. They look for validation on social media. I would always say to young girls that if they get onto their local sports field they will validate themselves by participating in sport, and they will get a real-life person validating their behaviours as well. With Sport Ireland, we recently developed a communication tool for coaches who are coaching teenage girls, to equip both male and female coaches in how to communicate with girls of that age and teach them what is and is not appropriate language. That is important because we might say something that a girl might misinterpret and that could start the spiral of them dropping out of sport. We also need to look at how sport is provided to girls of that age level. From holistic up to age 12, they are having fun and enjoyment and then from age 13 to 17 it is very elite and competitive. If girls are not making the team they wonder why they should stay playing. It goes back to the body image aspect as well. It is a mixed bag but online media has an impact on girls participating in sport.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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It has a huge impact. If we went back to when we did not have social media and compared that with now, I am sure there would be a stark difference. Did Dr. May have any comments to make on those questions?

Dr. Una May:

Only to reiterate what Ms O'Connor has said. Sport Ireland has been working very closely in the area of women's and girls' participation in sport.

We have put a great deal of emphasis, in particular, on the work around teenage girls because the level of drop out from that age cohort is a very significant concern for us. Ms O'Connor has identified some of the work we have been doing around coaching teenage girls. We have been working, in fact, on a European project expanding on the coaching of teenage girls in order to roll that out at a wider level, which has been very well received.

In our research around teenage girls we identified key issues which were barriers for their participation and, again, Ms O'Connor has alluded to a number of these around their perceptions of their sports, for example. Social media has a role to play in those areas, not so much around the abuse as around how they perceive their environment and contextualise their own participation in sport within social media. It was not necessarily identified in our research as something which was a key issue or as a barrier for girls and there were very many other broader and more substantial barriers for them. We have worked closely with RTÉ on the new programme they have just launched in the past week or two around retaining teenage girls in sport and have done a very significant amount of work in this area.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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Social media, then, is not seen as having a big impact on Sport Ireland's research.

Dr. Una May:

No, social media abuse, as such, did not come out as one of the big barriers in our research and has not been identified as one of the key barriers for girls.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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That surprises me, I have to say. I thank-----

Photo of Shane CassellsShane Cassells (Fianna Fail)
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Can I make one comment please on the retention of young female athletes in football or in any particular sport? I refer to the Ladies Gaelic Football Association, LGFA, because I am dealing with that association. We talk about the negative aspects of social media. There are also very many positives. I praise the LGFA for the social media campaign that it is running at the moment called The Greatest Gift to encourage parents to stay on the sideline and to actually watch their children playing. There is a great number of parents who come to games, drop their children and are gone, and do not bother to see the value of watching their own children playing. If they spend that hour, perhaps one might not quite have a scenario of hate, anger or any of those aspects developing then later in life. I wish to praise that particular social media campaign. The fact that they are using the Meath ladies to promote it is also fantastic.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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I call on the Deputy to stop there, please. Does Senator Carrigy want to have a final word?

Photo of Shane CassellsShane Cassells (Fianna Fail)
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If I can just say finally, a Chathaoirligh, that another interesting concept, about which the Chairman is aware, is that I play over-40s football on a Tuesday night and am recognised as one of the finest players, but we operate a system with no referee and we referee the match ourselves. We can do that in Meath because there is a scarcity-----

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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We have heard it all now. I call Senator Carrigy to speak now with the final say.

Photo of Micheál CarrigyMicheál Carrigy (Fine Gael)
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I think Senator Cassels must be playing over-age when playing over-40s.

First of all my apologies and my compliments to Ms O'Connor for coming here today. It was a very short period after having had the discussion on the issue for her to come back with concrete proposals. I concur with the comments of Senators Byrne and Cassells about the sports capital grants and the signage. I have been successful with sports capital applications but we have not had the documentation down to accept the funding, so I believe there is time to insert such a provision into this year's programme.

I welcome the Department's comments on the amendment I made on foot of what Larry McCarthy said at the GAA congress. I know that the GAA has started work on this itself.

We are going to give a far stronger level of protection to our children if we can implement this across the codes of conduct and the rulebooks of every sporting organisation in the country, where that process will be implemented at club, county and provincial level. It is very important and will give very significant protection to children, in particular, with regard to online safety in all sports. I picked the Federation of Irish Sport to work on the wording because it has over 110 governing bodies and has probably 1.5 million members of those organisations - I may be completely wrong on that figure - but it is very important that we can get that wording and have it inserted into the Bill. I thank the Chairman.

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Senator Carrigy for his comments and I thank our guests very much for attending. This is always such an interesting discussion to have and we are doing the players, the coaches and the spectators a service by having this conversation and keeping it going because, as Ms O'Connor said at the very beginning, this is a culture shift which has been allowed to happen in the past and we are now saying that it is no longer acceptable. It will take some time to change the minds and the thinking of some, but not of all.

I thank everybody for attending and we look forward to hearing from our guests again. We will now suspend briefly to allow the committee clerk to arrange for our second session with representatives from Screen Ireland, the Arts Council and Creative Europe Desk Ireland for a round-table discussion on Ireland in a creative Europe and Ireland's participation in and access to the Creative Europe 2021-2027 programme. We will suspend our committee meeting now for a few moments.

Sitting suspended at 2.55 p.m. and resumed at 3.09 p.m.