Maurice Cummins (Fine Gael)
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The Order of Business is No. 2, address to Seanad Éireann by Ms Nessa Childers, MEP, to be taken at 2 p.m. and to conclude no later than 4 p.m. in accordance with the arrangements set out in the motion passed by the House on 25 April 2013; and No. 35(10), Private Members' business, to be taken at 4 p.m. and to conclude no later than 6 p.m.

The Animal Health and Welfare Bill 2012 - Report Stage, which was due to be taken today after the Order of Business, has been deferred to a later date, as the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, Deputy Simon Coveney, is unavoidably obliged to be elsewhere. However, he has agreed to come to the House in the near future to deal with the Bill, and he has also promised debates on other matters of concern to Members in recent weeks, such as the fodder crisis, the CAP, fishery reforms and meat contamination.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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The Animal Heath and Welfare Bill was scheduled for today. Will the House stand adjourned during that time?

Maurice Cummins (Fine Gael)
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Yes. We will adjourn until 2 p.m. after the Order of Business.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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I understand the Minister is involved in other matters, and we hold the Presidency of the European Union, but it is disappointing that such short notice has been given for a change such as this. I would not like to see it as a precedent. In fairness to the Minister, he has a good attendance record in the Seanad. Senator Terry Leyden and others from all parties raised the ongoing fodder crisis yesterday. It is important that the Minister does his level best to come before the House as soon as possible. I suggest this should happen early next week. I do not run his diary but it is disappointing that such short notice was given. I respect the Minister and take him at his word.

It is not acceptable that there is still no Minister of State with responsibility for agriculture. It is a issue in terms of how business in this House and the Dáil operates. Is there any update from the Taoiseach on the replacement of the late Shane McEntee? If a new Minister of State had been in place, this situation would not have arisen. It shows very clearly that the Department is not operating at full capacity because there is a vacancy. Unfortunately we will oppose the Order of Business today on the basis of the very late change, because we cannot accept it.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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Hear, hear.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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I take the Leader and the Minister at their word but it is not acceptable and we must lay down a marker.

I ask the Cathaoirleach to indulge me because of the late change to the Order of Business. I have raised the issue of adult mental health services in this country numerous times and have given specific examples in north Dublin. It was recently agreed to seek a debate on the matter. Does the Leader have any update on the scheduling of that debate? It is a serious matter. Resources are not being provided in the sector. I would welcome an opportunity to put forward specific cases to the Minister.

On the protection of life during pregnancy Bill published yesterday evening, as Senator Ned O'Sullivan said yesterday, we all want a respectful and dignified debate that respects all views. The Bill will go to the Joint Committee on Health and Children. I do not agree with the calls yesterday for a debate here while that takes place. The joint committee is the right place for the Bill. I ask the Leader to make sure we have sufficient time to debate the Bill when it comes back from the joint committee.

I do not think it would be appropriate for us to debate it here while a debate is happening in the health committee. However, I ask the Leader to give sufficient time for everyone who wishes to speak on that - and I am sure most people will - when the appropriate time comes.

The Leader kindly gave an answer last week on the online betting tax Bill. Both of us are interested in ensuring it comes into the House quickly. There is a new Bill being prepared. Successive Governments, including this one and the last, have sat on their hands regarding taxing online betting at source. Our independent bookmakers are struggling and going out of business on a weekly basis because of the unlevel playing pitch for multinational online betting companies. Could the Leader impress on the Minister the urgency of that Bill coming to the House?

Could the Leader, in the next couple of weeks, arrange a debate on workers' rights? I ask that in the context of an Adjournment motion I put down yesterday evening on home help workers when the Minister's representative confirmed to me that more than 5,000 home help workers who worked between 2000 and 2008 are entitled to gratuity payments of four and a half weeks per year of service, an average payment of approximately €12,000. It has been confirmed to me that they are owed it and that the Government is in breach of two Labour Court recommendations but has no intention of paying this money. Deputy McGinley kindly said he would bring those views directly to the Minister but it would be an opportunity to debate workers' rights and how the State is treating them. I ask the Leader to schedule that in the coming weeks.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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I also welcome last night's publication of the heads of the protection of life during pregnancy Bill. I am really glad this Government is finally, 21 years after the "X" case, facing up to the responsibility we all have as legislators to introduce legislation which will provide for clarity in our law for pregnant women, their doctors and families as to when doctors may intervene to save women's lives by terminating pregnancies in the very rare cases when that arises. I entirely agree with Senator Darragh O'Brien that we should have ample time to debate it in this House when it comes before us on Second, Committee and Report Stages. I know the Leader will facilitate that request.

Senator Darragh O'Brien is correct that the health committee is the appropriate place to have the debate on the heads of the Bill. I understand the health committee is meeting tomorrow morning at 9.30 a.m. to commence that debate. We will see a very full debate. I entirely agree that it should be respectful and courteous but we also need to see this legislation go through the normal stages in the Dáil and Seanad and be brought into law without any further unnecessary delays. So while we need a full debate, I very much hope we will see it come into law before the summer recess. That is very important for the women of Ireland and I am really glad we are finally legislating on this important issue.

I welcome yesterday's announcement, while the Order of Business was in session - and other colleagues mentioned it - by Glanbia of the creation of 1,600 jobs in the south east. That is a really important announcement. This morning we see again an announcement of the creation of 100 high-level jobs in Squarespace which will set up headquarters in Dublin. This is a company in the ICT sector where we have seen 11,000 additional jobs in the last two years. The Government has rightly targeted this sector for growth and we are seeing real momentum here in job creation, so that is really important.

My final matter is a little further away from here, but again of concern. Colleagues will have seen recent reports about the hunger strike in the detention camp in Guantanamo Bay. It is very welcome to see President Obama renewing calls for the closure of Guantanamo Bay. Many of us were very disappointed that the centre was not closed during President Obama's first term of office. It is a blatant breach of the rights to due process of suspects - and indeed they are no more than suspects - held there in detention. Many of them have been held for many years and are protesting at their conditions and continued detention. We should raise concerns about it in this House because it is a matter of great international concern.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Do you have a question for the Leader?

Tony Mulcahy (Fine Gael)
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I acknowledge the Glanbia announcement yesterday. I have always been a great promoter of the added-value food production industry. We have the best organic product in the world and we need to support that, and that is how we will deliver indigenous jobs in this country. Would the Leader ask the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation, Deputy Bruton, to give us an overview as to how a project of this scale was put together with the support of his Department and Enterprise Ireland? It would be good for us to learn about this, given that in all the counties up and down the country we may well have similar opportunities, and if we knew how they were put together the Government would support those. I know there are confidential figures but I would like an overview of how the project was put together and delivered in the short space of the last two years.

Denis O'Donovan (Fianna Fail)
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I compliment the Minister, Deputy Rabbitte, on his U-turn regarding the sale of Coillte, if I may use this term very carefully. I welcome that. It was very manly and fair of Deputy Rabbitte in reflecting on the road he and his Department were going down. The sale of Coillte, in the way it was being suggested, would have had huge and disastrous consequences for this country. I raise again the ongoing, serious crisis farmers are facing regarding fodder. The situation is far more acute than it was two weeks ago. Yesterday I received a number of phone calls from people in my area. I am not being parochial because it is widespread. One widow was nearly crying on the phone because she said she had limited credit with her banks, she could not get money to buy fodder and she felt the hay that is being brought in, primarily from England, was being distributed unfairly.

I have also come across another complaint where some farmers who are not affected are actually hoarding bales. There must be a greater oversight by either the IFA or Teagasc of how the fodder coming in is being distributed to ensure those who are most affected get it first, irrespective of which organisation they are affiliated to, be it the Irish Farmers Association, IFA, the Irish Creamery Milk Suppliers Association, ICMSA, or whatever co-op.

I accept the fodder crisis has been caused by the weather with an unkind spring, desperate winter and a bad year before. To articulate my deep concern about this fodder crisis, however, I propose an amendment to the Order of Business, that a debate be held in the House on the fodder crisis. I know the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine is away but surely some other Minister who knows the plight of rural areas can attend the debate. I welcome this morning’s announcement by the IFA president, Mr. John Bryan, that his organisation will match €500,000 to the €500,000 promised by the agrifood sector. The €1 million provided by the Department is very little in this desperate situation. There will be no grass on the lands for another four weeks. This will have knock-on devastating consequences for agriculture and the agrifood industry over the next few months.

Aideen Hayden (Labour)
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I also welcome the publication of the heads of the protection of life during pregnancy Bill. As has been noted, successive Governments failed to legislate on this matter. What is before us now represents a sensible and workable solution within the Constitution as it now stands, unfortunately. Irish women who have faced a risk during pregnancy in Ireland have voted with their feet for many decades. However, there are categories of women who cannot avail of the right to travel such as women suffering from mental and physical disability or economic disadvantage. This legislation will protect their lives.

It is an unfortunate fact that women have not felt equally protected in this country. They have, for example, chosen certain hospitals where they have had a choice because they felt their lives were more protected there than they were in others. I agree with the Opposition that we should have nothing but measured and reasonable debate on this legislation. When it is enacted, I hope all women in this country will feel their lives are equally protected.

Will the Leader arrange a debate on the new code of conduct on mortgage arrears? The consultation process was to finish at the end of April. I believe this code should be put on a statutory basis. There were certain measures proposed for the new code that give cause for concern. The House, accordingly, should be engaged in an early debate on this issue.

It has come to my attention that while very few split mortgages have been offered to borrowers, what is on offer varies extensively. Will the Leader arrange a debate on this matter? Split mortgages and other solutions must be put into a proper formal code so that all borrowers know what is on offer to them.

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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Today is international workers’ day and this year is the centenary of the 1913 Lock-out. On several occasions I have called for a debate on workers’ rights, not just to mark the centenary but to address the many issues which affect working people in respect of their pay and pensions. Over the past several years we have seen incidents of workers being locked out of their jobs and not getting their full redundancy or pension payments. I have also called for a senior member of the Irish Congress of Trade Unions, ICTU, to attend the House to mark the important centenary of the Lock-out. At the time, I got a commitment from the acting Leader to have the Committee on Procedure and Privilege, CPP, examine this proposal. Will the Leader provide an update on this?

Later today I will be hosting an event in the audio-visual room at which the former Waterford Crystal workers who took the court case on their pensions will discuss the import of the European Court of Justice ruling. Their legal team, a pensions expert and the regional secretary of Unite will also make presentations. It is important the former Waterford Crystal workers get proper and adequate compensation for the fact the State failed in its duty to protect them.

It would be useful to have a debate on Harvest 2020. Yesterday’s positive announcement of 1,500 new jobs in Glanbia is welcome for Waterford and the south east. However, those 1,500 jobs will only be created if farmers can avail of the potential of Harvest 2020 and increase milk production. All the supports farmers need to achieve this must be put in place. Given the Glanbia announcement yesterday, it would be timely for the House to have a debate on Harvest 2020 and how farmers can reach the targets it sets out.

Caít Keane (Fine Gael)
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I commend yesterday’s statement from the Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Shatter, that he would be filling vacancies at chief superintendent level promptly.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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Why does he not reopen Templemore?

Caít Keane (Fine Gael)
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The Government has agreed with the Minister that moneys will be made available for the Garda. The Government is determined to support the Garda in its fight against crime. We have seen how the Minister and the Garda Commissioner work together. He has been criticised by gardaí and others for working too well with the Commissioner.

The Commissioner has supported the Garda Representative Association in its call for an independent authority to examine Garda pay and conditions, similar to the one which examined those of the Judiciary. The authority could be separate to or part of the judicial pay review. Ordinary rank-and-file gardaí on the streets, who put their lives and limbs at risk for us, should be included in this examination.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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I second Senator O’Donovan’s amendment to the Order of Business. He raised this matter several weeks ago and he is aware of the situation on the ground with fodder supplies. I commend John Bryan, president of the IFA, and other organisations which are putting up over €1 million to bring in 3,000 tonnes of high-quality hay from France. This is an indication that the IFA is not happy with the poor action taken by the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, Deputy Coveney, and the Department in this crisis. This is a fodder famine and action must be taken. Senator O’Donovan has outlined comprehensively the actions that need to be taken by the Minister. These are the actions we would take if we were in government. We would be hands-on, active on the ground and resolve this issue in a comprehensive way. Seemingly, the Minister, Deputy Coveney, does not seem to be that concerned about the fodder crisis in the west.

The scheme he has brought in is only for certain dairy co-operatives, not for farmers in general who may not have that type of contact. It is a very poor response to a crisis.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Is the Senator seconding the amendment?

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Very much so. I am delighted Senator O'Donovan has moved it. I commend him on voicing the problems so well over two weeks ago when this started.

Denis Landy (Labour)
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I welcome the statement made yesterday in the Dáil by the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources, Deputy Rabbitte, with regard to Coillte. He said yesterday that he thought he could also speak for his colleague, the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, Deputy Coveney, in that they were probably agreed that the mooted privatisation of Coillte looked more unlikely every day. We have had a number of debates in this House on Coillte. IMPACT commissioned Peter Bacon to do a report on the viability of the future retention of Coillte in State ownership and it proved conclusively that the proper economic thing to do was to retain Coillte, retain the 445,000 hectares of forestry under the control of Coillte, retain the 1,800 staff that are in work directly related to forestry, with €90 million in salaries on an annual basis. Yesterday's decision was a good decision and I hope it will be followed through.

I commend Senator Cullinane on his initiative in inviting staff and union representatives from Waterford Crystal to the AV room this afternoon. I come from Carrick-on-Suir and am aware of many employees of Waterford Crystal who lost their jobs and subsequently lost most of their pensions. That matter needs to be addressed by the Government as soon as possible. I look forward to the briefing this afternoon.

Yesterday was a good day for the south east, with the announcement by Glanbia of a new factory for milk production, which will create a couple of hundred jobs across the south east and improve the lot of the agricultural community across the country. This good news is much needed in the south east. The Leader may have an issue with regard to whether the new factory can be said to be in Waterford or Kilkenny, but we will get over that.

Finally, I welcome the students from Scoil Mhuire, Carrick-on-Suir, and their teachers, and I hope they enjoy their morning.

Labhrás Ó Murchú (Fianna Fail)
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This morning, some Members have welcomed the new abortion legislation, but I cannot share that welcome. I do not believe it is good legislation, nor that there is any evidence to show it is good for women. I do not believe it is good for society and it is certainly not good for the innocent baby whose life will be ended and who will not be given the opportunity to realise his or her full potential. I have always felt that human life is sacrosanct, that it is a human right and that this is a basic tenet of any civilised society. Once we breach that tenet, we enter unknown territory which will impact on other aspects of respect for life. I suppose we all hope there is still a chance to pull back and that perhaps in the health committee some sense will come forward to show that we are not really helping to solve the problems that have brought about this legislation.

I have made the point here from the very beginning of this traumatic debate that we should of course be respectful of other people's opinions. I have always endeavoured to be so. It is also right that we have the opportunity and the courage to express our own views. We should not feel in any way intimidated in expressing those views. I hope I am one of the many who will speak for those who have no voice of their own at the moment. I hope this will be kept in mind as this debate continues to develop.

Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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I agree with Senator O'Brien's call for us not to have a debate in this House on the protection of life during pregnancy Bill until after the health committee has concluded its proceedings. This is in line with what Senator Ó Murchú has just said. We are all pro-life and I agree with much of what he has just said. This is a complex and sensitive issue and we need to stay calm. None of us wants to cause division. The issue is about the life of the mother and of the unborn baby. Nobody wants to kill any unborn babies. We must be conscious of the fact that abortion is prohibited in Ireland and no change is envisaged in that regard. No change in the abortion law is proposed. We are all concerned about the issue of suicide and that is why we should wait for the conclusions of the health committee. However, it is necessary that we have legal clarity for medical practitioners on where medically necessary terminations are permissible. Of course we must work to save both lives, but the life of the unborn baby is dependent on the life of the mother. I would never wish to be in a situation in which I would have to make a decision, but we must provide that legal clarity. We may not like doing so, but we must face up to the issue. We must remember that what is being proposed is within the parameters of the Constitution. There is no constitutional change proposed and there is no change in the law. Let us continue to be calm and undivided and await the committee's findings. I agree with Senator O'Brien that we should not have a debate on the matter until after the health committee's proceedings.

Trevor Ó Clochartaigh (Sinn Fein)
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Arís, táim ag iarraidh mo dhíomá a léiriú maidir leis an athrú ar an chlár inniu, nach mbeidh muid ag plé an Bhille a bhaineann le leas ainmhithe. I am disappointed we will not have the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, Deputy Coveney, in the House today to debate the Animal Health and Welfare Bill. I agree with Senator O'Brien that he is one of the better attendees in the Seanad, but it is disappointing that he will not be here today. This indicates that there are problems in the Department. There have been particular difficulties over the past number of months, but the fact that no Minister of State has been appointed since the death of Shane McEntee shows that the Government needs to step up its operations and appoint somebody as quickly as possible so that the pressure can be taken off the Minister and so that somebody can come in here to debate issues. It is not good enough that debates are postponed and that other priorities such as the Presidency of the Council of the European Union take precedence over this House. The Government needs to ensure that we discuss all the legislation that is coming through.

On that note, I call again for a debate on the Leader programme, which is in disarray currently. There has been great uncertainty over the past year or so, particularly in Gaeltacht areas. Since the demise of Meitheal Forbartha na Gaeltachta, MFG, we have been unclear as to how much funding is still available and how much funding needs to be drawn down. A stop was put on spending under the Leader programme over the past number of months, but this was reversed, to a certain extent, just two weeks ago. However, it is still very unclear for the companies in question where they stand with regard to funding towards the end of the year and where they stand vis-à-vis the Minister's plans to try to have them subsumed into the county councils. There is great disquiet on the ground about that.

We need clarity as to whether the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, Deputy Howlin, will allow the matching funding be made available so that we can draw down the full allocation from Europe. Time is running out on this issue and it is important that the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government, Deputy Hogan, come to the House to debate the issue. Many of the projects that have been submitted for Leader have time constraints on them and if decisions are not made quickly and efficiently, some of them will fall by the wayside. We cannot afford to allow that happen, particularly in rural areas where we need every venture we can get to help boost the economy and keep jobs afloat. We need these to happen as quickly as possible and I call for an urgent debate on the issue.

Jimmy Harte (Labour)
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Along with Senator Landy and others, I was delighted to read Deputy Rabbitte's statement about the threatened sale of Coillte's harvesting rights. Last week in Donegal I said I could not see that happening and could see no reason for it to happen.

I believe there is a general consensus among all parties and Members that this should not happen. There is a social dividend in retaining the harvesting rights. It will be good news and shows that this Government can make decisions on its own without having to run back to Europe all the time, and this is one practical example. I hope it will be the norm in future that, when the troika leaves the country, we can make decisions based on-----

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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The sale of State assets has nothing to do with the troika agreement. The Government actually put it into the second memorandum. It was not in the original one.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Senator Harte without interruption. Has the Senator a question for the Leader?

Jimmy Harte (Labour)
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It is that we discuss this. Maybe the Opposition does not like when the Government-----

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Has the Senator a question for the Leader?

Jimmy Harte (Labour)
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It is that we discuss the sale of Coillte's harvesting rights and that the Minister come to the House to officially put it to bed. Those are the words everyone wants to hear and I call for that debate to take place. The Opposition may not see the good in it-----

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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We welcomed it.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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The Senator cannot see the wood for the trees - that is the problem.

Jimmy Harte (Labour)
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The Opposition will be disappointed.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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We will not be at all disappointed. We are happy they are starting to see sense on some things.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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At the very successful Fianna Fáil Ard-Fheis on Friday and Saturday evening, the leader of the party, Deputy Micheál Martin said:

Fifteen years ago Fianna Fáil negotiated and secured overwhelming public endorsement of a new departure North and South. ... What we are seeing today is an alarming disengagement by the British and Irish Governments, who act as if peace can be taken for granted. The flag riots and dissident violence simply cannot be ignored. What we need now is for the Governments to step up - not walk away.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Has the Senator a question for the Leader?

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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I want the Taoiseach to engage with his colleagues in the North. The Minister for Finance and Personnel in the North, Mr. Sammy Wilson, MP, is withholding the final funding for this beautiful bridge. The EU has agreed to contribute €18 million if the project goes ahead, with €3 million more being given by the Minister, Mr. Wilson, as the North's contribution. This beautiful bridge linking North and South will be built by 2015. President McAleese's theme as President was building bridges. What could be more appropriate than building this bridge connecting the Mourne Mountains and the Cooley Mountains and developing the tourism industry North and South? I see my colleague, Senator Terry Brennan, smiling and supporting me in what I am saying.

Terry Brennan (Fine Gael)
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I would love to open it.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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I recently watched Mr. Sammy Wilson on "Stormont Today". He likes to raise hackles and emotional divisions in the North continuously-----

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Has the Senator a question for the Leader?

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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I am asking him to give the final small amount of money to build this beautiful new infrastructure, North and South.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Invite him to the Seanad - that is what we should do.

Michael Comiskey (Fine Gael)
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I agree with my colleagues that there is a serious fodder crisis. However, I want to compliment the Minister on his work so far. He has made €1 million available and this is covering the cost of bringing in hay. I disagree with my colleague, Senator Leyden, about the south-west or south-north scenario he mentioned. Connacht Gold is importing fodder in the west and it is covered under the scheme, and I know there was hay in Carrick-on-Shannon yesterday and some hay in Sligo also.

I also want to compliment the IFA. I have spoken to IFA representatives in the past couple of days and know it has people in France since Thursday or Friday who have a large amount of hay ready to come by boat. It will be coming in this day next week, which will help to alleviate the problem. I want to compliment them on the establishment of the fund, along with the co-ops and agri-businesses. I know the Minister has talked to all of the banks and they have agreed they will make moneys available to the farming community. He has also talked to co-ops throughout the country, North and South, about making money available, and they have agreed to make it available free of interest, and also to make money available in the longer term for farmers to purchase fertiliser to make sure the grass is fertilised and starts growing. Hopefully, with an improvement in the weather over the coming days, the situation will improve.

We met a delegation of farmers yesterday in Leinster House and went through a number of the issues concerning them. All in all, we are working to get this problem sorted out and make sure no animals die. The Minister has assured us there is an emergency fund and a lo-call telephone line for farmers who have a difficulty, which is operated by the Department. We want to make sure no animals die as a result of this difficulty we are having.

Marc MacSharry (Fianna Fail)
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Will the Leader arrange for a statement to be made, perhaps by the Minister for Finance or whatever Minister is available in the near future, in regard to the "Prime Time" programme last night, particularly the fact that individual as opposed to institutional investors in tracker bonds have effectively been burned as a result of the liquidation of IBRC? The programme highlighted what appears to be a very sad case and one wonders how many more such cases there are, whether quite a few people were involved and what proposals the Government has to do something for these people. One wonders how we can have looked after the senior and junior bondholders worldwide when we rushed so quickly in the process of liquidation to burn an individual, as we saw last night. It is an important issue and, while I know there are other important and controversial issues to be dealt with today, I feel this is one that should not be passed over. I would appreciate it if the Minister could make a statement on the matter.

In agreeing with our leader's opposition to today's Order of Business, I make the point it does not serve the Leader's efforts well. I have said many times that, in my 11 years here, Senator Cummins has been the best Leader in the context of trying to use the Seanad space in a constructive way.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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Hear, hear.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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Hear, hear.

Marc MacSharry (Fianna Fail)
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When a Minister, for whatever reason, is called away on important business in a European context or otherwise, which can of course happen, and a Minister of State is not available, we in the House are well used to having Ministers other than the line Ministers for particular debates. Despite the fodder crisis and, not least, the importance of the Animal Health and Welfare Bill itself, we are going to have a lengthy break today. In addition, if nobody can be found to discuss the matter, I do not believe it to be an efficient use of the House's time or that of the staff of the Houses of the Oireachtas. We are here to participate in debates. The Order Paper is filled with very good suggestions, from Private Members' Bills to non-Government motions, that could usefully be debated in this House, and, indeed, we have even had debates here without Ministers. While I do not support that, I certainly feel a Minister of State can be found. There should be a Minister of State on stand-by at short notice to hear whatever business the Leader so determines in this House.

Colm Burke (Fine Gael)
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I welcome the decision by the Government yesterday in regard to proceeding with the publication of the heads of the protection of life during pregnancy Bill. I agree with Senator O'Brien that it is important that there be a reasoned debate on this matter. I know some Senators, such as Senator Labhrás Ó Murchú, have very strong views and I very much respect those views. However, it is important to realise that in the 1983 referendum, the wording used was "guarantees in its laws to respect". It is interesting that in both the High Court, in the X case, and in the Supreme Court, Mr. Justice Costello, Mr. Justice McCarthy and Mr. Justice Finlay all referred to this point, and the argument was put forward that if the Constitution uses the word "laws", there is an obligation on the Oireachtas to establish laws. In that case, the defence put forward the argument that the courts had no power to deal with the matter because there were no laws enacted. That is what the amendment to the Constitution in 1983 provided, namely, that "the State ... guarantees in its laws ... to defend and vindicate that right ". We are now moving to put in place the proper procedure. The important point is that we cannot go beyond what the Constitution provides.

This is not a proposal to change the Constitution. It is to bring forward legislation which must stay within the confines of the Constitution. In January we had three very good days at the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Health and Children. I hope a similar opportunity will be given to people who have both middle-of-the-road and extreme views in order that all parties can be listened to in this debate before the legislation is finally enacted. It would not be appropriate for this House to have a debate while this process is proceeding.

I compliment Senator David Cullinane on making arrangements for the presentation today by the workers from Waterford Crystal. I also compliment the Leader. About two years ago I produced a proposal to ensure greater scrutiny of EU legislation within the House. I know that proposal has not been accepted. It is interesting, however, that workers had to go to court to establish their rights, for which I pay tribute to them. We need to make people aware of their entitlements under EU law, as well as Irish law. That is the reason a debate on the matter in this House is important.

Ned O'Sullivan (Fianna Fail)
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I support the call by Senator David Cullinane for a proper commemoration of the 1913 Lock-out, a seminal event in our history. In particular, I commend the Senator's excellent proposal that the leaders of the trade union movement and the Irish Congress of Trade Unions address the House as a fitting way to commemorate the event. I have highlighted on many occasions the responsible role played by congress in tacking the economic crisis. It is unfortunate that we have reached something of an impasse in respect of Croke Park II, but I am confident that the trade union movement will put the good of the nation first, as it always has.

I also commend the GRA for an excellent annual conference and support the call by Senator Cáit Keane for pay levels in the Garda Síochána to be considered by an independent commission in the same way as the pay levels of members of the Judiciary are considered. That would be much fairer and give relief to gardaí, many of whom are suffering from very serious personal insolvency and financial difficulties.

I commend the Minister for Arts, Heritage and Gaeltacht Affairs for agreeing to sanction investigative work on the wreck of the Lusitania which, as we all know, sank in 1915 with huge loss of life. Its sinking has remained a controversial issue ever since regarding the question of whether it was carrying military ordinance. In co-operation with the legal owner of the wreck, an American gentleman called Mr. Bemis, the Minister has agreed to some of the artefacts being put on display in a museum. The investigation should throw some light on a subject that has puzzled us for many years.

Terry Brennan (Fine Gael)
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I compliment my colleague, Senator Mary White, on recognising the advantage of the new bridge and what the Taoiseach should be doing. I assure her that the Taoiseach has the matter in hand and is meeting his Northern counterparts and the British Prime Minister on the very same issue, which is political. Her colleague and my friend from north County Louth, Councillor Peter Savage, will be delighted by what she has had to say this morning.

I know carbon taxes on coal and briquettes have been introduced today. Standard Brands which is not a small company as it employs 100 people in Killcare and Castlebellingham, County Louth, mainly manufactures fire lighters and has done so for many generations. It manufactures a fire log. I think it is the log end of the business to which the carbon tax applies. It is a glorified firelighter which compliments what Standard Brands already manufactures. It is a substitute for similar imported logs from Germany and the Netherlands.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Does the Senator have a question for the Leader?

Terry Brennan (Fine Gael)
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I do. I ask him to consult the Minister, his Department and Revenue. They are really splitting hairs. It is not a log as one might-----

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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It might be more suitable to raise the matter on the Adjournment.

Terry Brennan (Fine Gael)
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It is not one for the Adjournment. It must be dealt with quickly as the tax has been introduced from today. I am asking for a review of the inclusion of the fire log which is not used in the same way as a briquette or a bucket of coal. It is a glorified firelighter. I, therefore, ask the Leader to ask the Minister to review the matter, as eight to ten jobs could be lost.

Feargal Quinn (Independent)
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I am usually loath to speak about what is happening in other part of the world that we do not know very well. It seems, however, that there is a need for a public outcry against the number of public executions taking place in Iran. Last month alone, there were 100 executions in prisons that we know of, many of them public hangings. There were 82 public hangings or executions in one earlier 13 day period. There is a need for a worldwide outcry, as there must be a better solution to all of Iran's problems. I am sure it has major problems, but there must be some way to draw the attention of the regime in Iran to the fact that there is an outcry around the world. An effort is being made by parliamentarians to get in touch with the regime in Iran to tell it how much we abhor what is happening there. It has been reported that 1,000 people are on death row awaiting execution. This issue needs the world's attention. I, therefore, urge the Leader to get in touch with the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade to make the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees aware that we need to see a change in how this regime is behaving and that we need to protect the human rights of the people of Iran.

Michael Mullins (Fine Gael)
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I strongly support the call by Senator Feargal Quinn that we ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade to take up the issue of the totally unacceptable, barbaric and appalling situation in Iran where significant numbers of people are being executed. I thought that there was a more humane environment in most parts of the world but there is a most appalling situation in Iran which must be addressed.

I ask the Leader to organise for the Minister of State with responsibility for housing and planning to come to the House to discuss the issue of social housing. It is welcome that NAMA has made available a total of 339 social housing units to date and identified up to 4,000 units, in 1,500 of which local authorities have confirmed an interest. The numbers on social housing waiting lists in all local authority areas are at crisis point. It is, therefore, necessary for us to have a full and frank debate with the Minister of State on how we can speed up the making available of the many houses lying idle throughout the country, some of them in housing estates but many others are one-off houses in rural Ireland. I would appreciate it if the Leader organised for the Minister of State to come to the House to discuss the issue.

Rónán Mullen (Independent)
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I repeat my request to the Leader that we have a debate on the draft heads of the legislation on abortion produced by the Government. The other House should debate it also.

The more I read the heads of this Bill the more I feel this is a really dark day. The Government is proposing something dangerous and destructive. I am very disappointed that our Taoiseach has led us to this point. His advisers and some of his Ministers have cooked up an unworthy political compromise on a life and death issue. The lines coming from the Government about this being restrictive and life-saving and necessary to implement a law that is already there are simply not true. This is about opening the door to abortion and not just by a chink. Under pressure, particularly from the Labour Party, the Taoiseach and his Government have ignored the tide of medical evidence against legislating on the grounds of suicide, not to mention the deep concerns expressed by more than 100 psychiatrists who appear to represent the overwhelming majority of their profession. It appears the hearings held by the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Health and Children last January were just a charade not because of what was said at them which decisively rejected the notion of abortion as evidence-based treatment for suicide-----

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Does the Senator have a question for the Leader?

Rónán Mullen (Independent)
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Yes. My question is whether we can have this debate. These hearings were completely ignored and if we have more committee meetings they will be a charade as well. It is part of the careful choreographing of this issue. People are not equal members at committees, as is well known. This is a life and death issue that should be debated in each of these Houses. The Order of Business is not the moment to go through the really noxious and sinister aspects of this Bill which are certainly there. I will not put down an amendment to the Order of Business today because my colleagues deserve an opportunity to read the heads of the Bill and to see how awful some aspects of this proposed Bill are. I will, however, propose amendments to the Order of Business next week. The Taoiseach should be accountable to the Houses on such a fundamental issue. It is important that the Minister for Health and Children would go before both Houses and that each House would have an opportunity to debate this. We must not be herded and stage-managed. That is what has been happening all along on this issue. It is really unworthy of the Government to have done it in this way. Further hearings by the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Health and Children will only add to that. I say that with great respect to the Chairman and the other members but we cannot have a proper debate if the committee hearings are used to manage the flow of information and the presentation of this Bill.

John Kelly (Labour)
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Senator Brennan commented on my contribution yesterday on carbon tax. I agree with him and I know that down the road there will be serious job losses as a result of the imposition of this tax but I would be prepared to seek a debate on the adjournment on this matter with Senator Brennan next week if the Cathaoirleach would oblige us.

I welcome the news about Coillte and that our State lands will not be sold off. I am particularly pleased because I always believed there was a relationship between Coillte and the wind energy sector and maybe now the wind energy sector realises that wind energy is not the way forward and is pulling back from it.

In recent days I have heard radio announcements telling people to deal with their local property tax within the next few days as a matter of urgency, whatever that means. I have a document telling us that it must be done by 1 July but it also states that one must complete and submit property tax returns by 28 May. We have been given three dates, next week, 28 May and 1 July. Can the Leader clarify this? People do not know the actual deadline.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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If the Senator wishes to submit a matter on the Adjournment before 3 o'clock today it could be considered for tomorrow.

Martin Conway (Fine Gael)
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I welcome the publication of the heads of the Bill early this morning. At least people need not now speak in a vacuum but with something on which to go. In order to be positive and move forward this very important issue I suggest to the Leader and to the Committee on Procedure and Privileges that they make the Seanad Chamber available again to the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Health and Children if it requires it.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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That issue has been dealt with.

Martin Conway (Fine Gael)
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Perhaps it has but I am raising it anyway as a point of information.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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It was dealt with yesterday.

Martin Conway (Fine Gael)
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I apologise if it was dealt with yesterday.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Does the Senator have a question for the Leader?

Martin Conway (Fine Gael)
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I am coming to it. I would like the Leader to tell the Chairman of the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Health and Children that significant and serious discussion on the heads of this Bill will be necessary and that every Member should have an opportunity to listen to all information available and there should be no time restriction. Any competent professional body who wishes to make a submission to the committee should be facilitated. This meeting might run for longer than three days. This is an important issue and it needs to be dealt with urgently because there is so much public concern. We have a responsibility to try to move it on as quickly as possible to ensure people are adequately informed so that they can make appropriate decisions when necessary.

Maurice Cummins (Fine Gael)
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Senator Darragh O'Brien spoke about the inability of the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, Deputy Coveney, to attend the House. The Minister tendered his apology. I hope the Minister will come here on Thursday next and that he will discuss the fodder crisis then but I do not have confirmation of that. If we do amend the Order of Business I am willing to accept that we can discuss it today without a Minister if that will suffice. It would be better to have the Minister here next Thursday but I am willing to co-operate with the House on that matter. I will amend the Order of Business if Senators want to hold that debate now but there will be no Minister here. I am amenable to the wishes of the House. It does not often happen that Ministers cry off at short notice especially in respect of legislation but it has happened and the Minister apologises.

I take on board Senator Darragh O'Brien's comments on the protection of life during pregnancy Bill. It will go to the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Health and Children and will come back to both Houses after those hearings. I assured the House yesterday that there will be full and ample time afforded to any Member who wishes to speak on that Bill on all Stages. We will provide ample time and anybody who wishes to speak will be afforded the time to speak. The majority of Members believe that is the time when we should discuss this Bill and that we should leave the heads of the Bill to the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Health and Children. Senator Mullen disagrees and I understand his feelings on that matter but that is what we intend doing on that Bill.

Senator O'Brien also raised the question of the Betting (Amendment) Bill and online betting. I support his sentiments and will endeavour to find out when that Bill will come to the House. I understand that the Department of Finance is framing it. There had been a link between the Departments of Agriculture, Food and the Marine and Justice, Equality and Defence, and Finance. All three were involved in it. I hope that will be in the House in the autumn session if not before.

Senator Bacik welcomed the 1,600 jobs for Glanbia, as did Senator Landy and other Members. It is a significant boost to rural communities, especially in the south east. They also welcomed the 100 jobs announced in the ICT sector today in Dublin. All of these announcements are to be welcomed. They show that the action plan for jobs is working and bearing fruit.

Senator Norris and several other Members have commented on the protection of life during pregnancy Bill. We should reserve our comments until we come to discuss the Bill. I do not intend to comment on what Members have said about it.

Senator Mulcahy also welcomed the Glanbia jobs announcement and asked that the Minister, Deputy Bruton, be invited to the House to give an overview of the project. Senator O'Donovan raised the fodder crisis. Yesterday, I announced that a helpline had been set up by the Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine, the number of which is 1850 211 990. As stated by the Department no animal should die and it will pay for fodder to be brought to people in crisis. Senator Comiskey outlined the measures put in place by the co-ops, banks, IFA and all others involved. It is up to the Opposition to decide whether it wishes to have that debate today without a Minister or next Thursday with a Minister.

Senator Hayden raised the issue of split mortgages and insolvency procedures. I am sure we will have a further debate on that issue. While the Minister of State, Deputy O'Sullivan, will be in the House soon to deal with housing legislation, I am not sure if the Senator's concerns can be addressed in that context. I will try to arrange a debate on the matter.

Senators Cullinane and O'Sullivan asked that particular persons be invited to address this House as a commemoration of the 1913 Lock-out. That matter is on the agenda of the next meeting of the Committee on Procedure and Privileges. The Senators also called for a further debate on Harvest 2020.

Senator Keane spoke about the promotions in particular ranks in An Garda Síochána announced yesterday by the Minister, Deputy Shatter, and called, like Senator O'Sullivan, for Garda pay to be addressed by an independent commission.

Senator Leyden seconded the amendment in relation to the debate on the fodder crisis, which issue he also raised yesterday. Senator Landy and several others referred to the announcement by the Minister, Deputy Rabbitte, that the sale of harvesting rights will probably not proceed at this point in time. Senator Landy also welcomed the briefing on the Waterford Crystal workers' situation in the AV room at 2 p.m. today and the jobs announced by Glanbia.

Senators Ó Murchú, Coghlan and Mullen asked about the protection of life during pregnancy Bill 2013. We will deal with the matters raised by the Senators when the Bill comes before the House.

Senator Ó Clochartaigh asked about the Leader programme. I do not agree with him that the Leader programme is in disarray. I understand significant funding was announced in some areas only last week. I am sure that the Minister, Deputy Hogan, would be willing to come to the House to update Senators on the matter.

Senator White raised the issue of the Good Friday Agreement. I can assure the Senator that there is no disengagement whatsoever in this regard on behalf of the Irish Government. On the Narrow Water Bridge, which was also raised in the House on many occasions by Senators D'Arcy and Brennan, I am confident that the finance to allow that project to proceed will be made available.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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Good.

Maurice Cummins (Fine Gael)
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Senator Comiskey outlined the measures being taken by all agencies in relation to the fodder crisis. Senator MacSharry asked that the Minister for Finance come to the House to make a statement on the problems arising from the liquidation of IBRC. I am sure that the Minister, Deputy Noonan, will address that matter in early course.

Senator O'Sullivan welcomed the proposal by the Minister, Deputy Deenihan, in relation to the investigation work on the wreck of the Lusitania. I am sure it is welcomed by all. Senator Brennan called for an exemption for a specific type of fire log from carbon tax and for a review of the compilation of the logs. As mentioned by the Cathaoirleach, if the Senator tables the matter for discussion on the Adjournment before 3 p.m. today, that matter can be dealt with tomorrow. I believe that would be the best way of dealing with that matter.

Senator Quinn raised the issue of public executions in Iran. It is an appalling situation and a breach of human rights. I will bring the matter to the attention of the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade and will report back to the House with his observations.

Senator Mullins raised the issue of social housing and asked that the Minister of State, Deputy O'Sullivan, come to the House to discuss the matter. The Minister of State will be in the House later in the month to deal with housing legislation, at which time the Senator can raise the issue with her.

Senator Kelly spoke about Coillte and the property tax. I understand that properties must be registered by 28 May and payments must be made by 21 July. Should the Senator require any further information, he should contact the Revenue helpline. I am sure the Department of the Environment, Community and Local Government would also assist in the matter should the Senator require further clarification.

On the issue raised by Senator Conway, the Committee on Procedure and Privileges has agreed to make the Chamber available to the health committee on particular days should it require it.

Martin Conway (Fine Gael)
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Hear, hear.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Senator O'Donovan has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business, "That a debate on the fodder crisis be taken today". Is the amendment being pressed?

Maurice Cummins (Fine Gael)
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I would like to clarify that if the Senator wishes the debate to go ahead today without a Minister, I will agree to it. It is totally unacceptable that Senators would expect a Minister to come to the House within ten minutes.

Denis O'Donovan (Fianna Fail)
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My amendment seeks that a Minister with a knowledge of rural Ireland would come to the House to debate the issue. The situation is acute. It would be remiss of me as a member of the agricultural panel to not even raise this issue. According to the people who contacted me yesterday, the helpline is a cop-out and a waste of time.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Is the amendment being pressed?

Denis O'Donovan (Fianna Fail)
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Yes.