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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: -----agriculture is a matter for the Joint Committee on Agriculture, Food and the Marine. The Senator might focus on that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: It is nothing to do with means testing.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: We can all see that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: Yes. I thank Senator Garvey. I gave the Senator an awful lot of scope. I will not be giving the witnesses that scope. I want them to stick to the topic on the agenda. Senator Garvey asked questions on income disregards and whether there is another model. She touched on the issue of depreciation in capital allowances in terms of on-farm investment. Which of the witnesses wants to...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: Allow Mr. Farrell to continue without interruption, Senator Garvey.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: I am sorry to interrupt, but can Mr. Roddy elaborate on what he means by "a poverty trap"?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: Ms Doyle wants to come in.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: Did Senator Garvey have a brief supplementary question?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: I thank the Senator. Mr. Fitzgerald will be first and then Mr. Farrell.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: I will bring in Senator Wall in a second but to answer Senator Garvey in terms of gross versus net and if the Revenue Commissioners model was used, Revenue looks at net income rather than gross income.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: In fairness, I will bring in Deputy Ó Cuív, but Senator Wall has been here from the start of the meeting and I wish to give him his chance.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: Before bringing in Senator Wall, on that double ACRES payment, the committee will write directly to the Minister, making her aware of this payment and that there would be consideration given to that. On foot of this meeting, we will write about that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: Deputy Ó Cuív wishes to comment on Mr. Buckley's evidence.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: I think the problem arises because-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: Farm assist was an income-averaging scheme where they looked at one's previous year's income and then projected forward on a typical year. The difficulty is now because it is reviewed on an annual basis, it has become an annual scheme rather than an averaging scheme. I think this may be where the problem arises with it.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: Anyway, we will take it up directly with the Minister. It is important to remember that the farm assist scheme is a safety net for farm families. That is what it is. It is supposed to be a source of assistance to protect farm families from poverty. The point was correct that the Revenue Commissioners have an averaging scheme. The farm assist scheme, as originally designed, was an...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: We will now hear from Ms Doyle.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: I thank Ms Doyle. Now we will hear from Mr. Roddy.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: We will now hear from Mr. Smyth.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection: Impact of Means Testing on Farm Assist and Other Social Welfare Schemes: Discussion (17 Apr 2024)

Denis Naughten: Does Deputy Ó Cuív have any final comments?

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