Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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Question 1: To ask the Minister for Justice; Equality and Law Reform the number of suspects who have re-offended while on bail in 2009 and to date in 2010; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [19716/10]

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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For some time I have been concerned at the number of offences being committed by persons on bail. Therefore, I requested and obtained Government approval late last year to commence work on a new bail Bill. The options that will be considered for inclusion in the new bail Bill include the following - providing that the courts must have regard to the nature and seriousness of any danger to any person or the public posed by the release of the accused person on bail; the creation of presumptions that bail should be refused for people charged with certain types of serious crime - in view of European Convention on Human Rights restrictions, such presumptions would act as a form of guidance to the courts in identifying those who present unacceptable risks of committing serious offences if granted bail; and extending the powers of the courts to refuse bail where necessary to prevent the commission of further offences to include more minor offences below the current level of seriousness required by the Bail Act 1997.

Other issues that will be considered for inclusion are provisions relating to the following - no automatic bail on appeal from a District Court conviction; inclusion of public safety-public order criteria; power of arrest for gardaí for breach of bail conditions; provision of guidance to the courts against granting bail in certain serious cases; reasons to be given when a prosecution objection to bail is overruled in certain cases; and proving foreign convictions.

This proposed legislation is complex and requires close consultation with relevant offices, including the Office of the Attorney General. I hope to be in a position to bring proposals to Government before the end of the year.

The Criminal Justice Act 2007 strengthened the law with the aim of facilitating a stronger challenge by the prosecution to applications for bail by persons charged with serious offences and of further improving decision making by the courts. In addition, the law provides for adverse consequences for a person who commits an offence while on bail.

Statistics compiled by the Central Statistics Office indicate that in 2009 there were 27,228 offences recorded where the suspected offender was on bail. It should be noted that these figures refer to the number of offences committed, not the number of suspected offenders on bail. In 2010, up to 31 March, there were 5,398 such crimes recorded. As the number of such crimes recorded in 2008 was 29,568, the 2009 figure represents a reduction of 8% on the previous year.

The decision to grant bail in a particular case is a matter for the court, which is, subject only to the Constitution and the law, independent in the exercise of its judicial functions. There is a constitutional presumption in favour of bail, since, in the eyes of the law, a person is innocent until proven guilty.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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The Minister tried for as long as he could to avoid the question, which is quite specific in its import, asking the Minister the number of suspects who have re-offended. Of course, hidden in his spin was the true figure, where he revealed that almost 30,000 crimes per annum are committed by persons who have been suspected and charged with serious crime. The Minister refuses to give the full story.

Would the Minister agree that the chief suspects in 15 murders committed in the past 20 months were out on bail and he has been particularly tardy in dealing with this issue? I suggest the real reason for his tardiness or inability to deal with this issue is prison overcrowding and the longer he delays in dealing with reform of the bail laws, the more law abiding citizens are refused by this Government a basic level of protection on our streets.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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No. The figures speak for themselves. As I stated, 27,000 offences amount to a reduction of 8% on the previous year. One offender could have committed ten offences. That is how they are compiled and it does not represent the overall figure for number of offenders.

Of course, we all are worried about people who are out on bail. As I stated earlier, as Deputy Flanagan knows well, the Judiciary is independent in the way in which it operates and under the Constitution everyone is entitled to his or her freedom, subject to conditions, until proven guilty. Those are the parameters within which we must operate.

When I came into office there had been changes made in 2007 to restrict bail even more, but the strong advice to me is that we cannot go too much further or else we will contravene, not just under the Constitution but under the European Convention on Human Rights, the personal freedom of persons.

As I stated earlier, we are trying to tighten up a number of issues, bring in new conditions and lower the bar in relation to seriousness of offences where there would be a more strict criteria on the granting of bail. That work is ongoing and I want to bring it forward as soon as possible.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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It is regrettable that the Minister does not have the good grace to accept that this is a scandal under his watch. It is too much to expect that he would.

All accept the independence of the Judiciary and there is no question of anybody here engaging in anything that might compromise that independence.

I have two questions. Has the Minister examined the feasibility of asking the courts to consider the safety of a member of the community or of the general public in the context of a bail application being made, and whether that might be an issue that could be considered? That, to my mind, would in no way interfere with the independence of the Judiciary.

Has the matter of delay, between the time of arrest, charge and caution and the ultimate trial taking place, been looked at? Has he met with the executives of the Courts Service to deal with the matter of delay because this is an issue too? Not only are we dealing with the circumstances under which bail can be granted and the criteria that might be adjudged by the court, but the issue of lengthy delays in criminal trials between the time a suspect is arrested, charged and cautioned and the ultimate trial is an issue that in no way interferes with any European Convention or law or the independence of the Judiciary, and is, in effect, a real issue.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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As I stated earlier, one of the issues I am asking my officials to look at in the context of this new bail Bill is providing that the courts must have regard to the nature and seriousness of any danger to any person or the public posed by the release of the accused person on bail. We are asking that such be one of the criteria, subject to confirmation by the Attorney General that we can do that. As I stated, my clear instructions to my officials, and, indeed, to the Attorney General's office, is that we want to push the boat out as far as we can.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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I thought the Minister asked the Attorney General last year.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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It does not matter whether it is me, Deputy Flanagan or anyone else who is on this side of the House, we must take cognisance of the constitutional requirements on personal freedom and, indeed, all the various international agreements to which we are party.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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Was the Attorney General not asked a year ago?

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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The issue of the time between arrest, charge and caution and bringing forward a trial, is a matter not only for the Courts Service, but for the Garda Síochána which is putting together files which must go to the DPP, etc. Of course, there is always an insistence when the Department would meet with the Courts Service and with the Garda, etc., that as little time as possible would be involved. However, one cannot hurry justice in that a mistake could be made, given that, ultimately, one is talking about putting persons into prison. In ensuring that every "t" is crossed and every "i" is dotted in the proving of an offence, it is important that people take their time and not rush it in order to ensure that the case sticks.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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Meanwhile people are being killed on the streets.