Aodhán Ó Ríordáin (Dublin Bay North, Labour) | Oireachtas source

It might surprise the Minister of State to hear me be complimentary of the Government's efforts in this field. Many, including me, were unsure as to whether breaking up the Department of Education and establishing a new Department was a good move. However, in fairness to the Minister of State, Deputy Collins, and the Minister, Deputy Harris, I think they have made it work. I feel they have placed a large emphasis on the area of apprenticeships and they have done good work in this space in the past two years. When work is done, when systemic issues have been tackled and when new ministerial responsibility has been put around it, that is to be commended. It also means that, when it comes to issues of apprenticeships, higher education and further education, the Department is not swamped with other education issues and it can focus on this. This kind of debate is a testament to that.

That is not to say there are not issues that need to be addressed. Apprenticeships in the public sector are long overdue, so that is a positive. The difficulty with the model is that, again, it appears to be employer-led and there is no indication that is necessarily going to change any time soon. I believe councils and local authorities are key to this, including those in my own area, Dublin City Council and Fingal County Council. Apprenticeships within councils will be crucial to allowing young people to move into a field of work, and that has to be expanded over the coming period. We also need to build skills for the new green economy. The numbers the Minister of State has outlined look well, but if we scratch the surface of the numbers, 60% of all of those apprenticeships are in two trades. We need to expand the type of apprenticeships we are resourcing. Building skills in the green economy and allowing the public sector to lead the way in apprenticeships and in building capacity is what we need to focus on. The national apprenticeship office looks great but it is far from being fully established because of staffing issues, which is something we need to focus on.

It has been said that one of the fallouts from the crash was that developers and the industry prefer to sublet jobs, as opposed to taking on apprentices, because apprenticeship is a four-year commitment. When this area is so employer-led, we tend to make mistakes in that way and we are not allowing the system to be led by the experience of the apprentice. The experience is that in year one of their given craft, an apprentice, for example, a carpenter, can earn as little as €6.84 an hour, with those in year two earning only €10.26 an hour, both of which are below the national minimum wage.

I believe the Government has taken this area seriously. The division of the Department was a good move and the fact we are even having this debate is testament to the fact we now have a Minister of State we can talk to in this area when that would not have been possible previously. However, our belief is we need to move to having apprenticeships that are going to serve the green economy, and we need to have it done in such a way that apprenticeships do not have such poor wages, that they are not dominated by the old traditional trades, and that the local authorities are seen as key to future growth in this area.

The new national apprenticeship office must be supported to do its work. If there are staffing issues or if it needs more legislative underpinning, we need to address that quickly.

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