Michael McGrath (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the opportunity to make a contribution to this debate. The debate so far today and the general public debate on this issue have been respectful. I have always believed one does not have to agree with someone to respect him or her or to listen carefully to his or her views.

I will oppose the Bill for one primary reason. I have continuing concerns that the termination of a pregnancy on the grounds of suicidal ideation is not evidence based. In fact, the evidence from the experts who support the Bill and also those who oppose it is that abortion cannot in any way be regarded as a treatment for somebody who is genuinely suicidal. My baseline position on this issue is that I believe in protecting life. I believe in protecting the life of the pregnant mother and the life of the unborn baby. I have a wife, a mother, a daughter and sisters and to suggest, as some do, that those of us with sincere concerns about aspects of the Bill do not trust women is absolute nonsense and a distortion of the debate surrounding the Bill.

Any legislation to protect lives in pregnancy should be based on evidence. I followed the two sets of hearings at the Oireachtas health committee as closely as I could. On the medical side, the evidence was very clear. Practitioners believe additional legal clarity is required to allow them to intervene to save the life of the mother when there are medical complications, whether those complications derive from a life threatening physical illness such as cancer or a medical emergency. On this point, the evidence from clinicians was categorical and I have no difficulty with those aspects of the Bill. For complete clarity, I believe that where a medical issue arises which poses a risk to the life of the mother; the clinicians must be empowered to do whatever is necessary to save her life. I accept that there will be times when this results in the loss of the unborn baby. I understand this type of intervention happens in maternity hospitals throughout Ireland between 30 and 40 times a year.

On the question of suicide, the Government's essential argument is that the Supreme Court's decision in the X case which provides for a termination where there is a real and substantial risk to the life of the mother, including the threat of suicide, must be legislated for. It also cites the decision of the European Court of Human Rights, ECHR, in the A, B and C v. Ireland case, although I note and accept the Government has stated the ECHR judgment did not require it to legislate for suicide as a ground for an abortion. I listened carefully to the legal arguments made at the health committee on whether Ireland had to legislate for suicide as a basis for abortion. On one side, some eminent legal experts argue that the X case judgment is the law of the land and must be legislated for. Other equally eminently qualified legal experts argued differently. The key question is whether the Supreme Court's interpretation of Article 40.3.3^o in the X case is definitive in all circumstances and determinative for subsequent legislation.

Dr. Maria Cahill, a lecturer in constitutional law in University College Cork, who gave evidence to the Oireachtas committee said the X case was in a separate category of judicial decisions because of what it did not decide. She went on to say a precedent was only binding relative to the points decided in the case. The evidence in the X case on the suicide question was not contested and, according to Dr. Cahill, did not constitute a precedent. I am not a constitutional lawyer and Deputies with different views on the Bill can quote other legal experts to support their argument. I accept that. However, when I hear legal experts, all of whom I respect, fundamentally disagreeing on the key question of whether the State has to legislate for abortion on the grounds of suicide, I must make up my own mind on the basis of what I believe to be right and wrong.

The key issue for me is that there is no evidence whatsoever to suggest a real and substantial risk to the life of the mother caused by suicidal ideation can ever only be averted by the termination of the pregnancy. That is what the Bill provides for in section 9, that an abortion can only be permitted on suicide grounds where it is the only way of averting the suicide. When the Oireachtas is making decisions, it turns to experts, particularly when deliberating at committee level. The experts in psychiatry are overwhelmingly telling us the same thing, that abortion is not a treatment for suicidal ideation. I am entitled to ask the question: is abortion ever the only answer for somebody with suicidal tendencies? Even even more importantly, is it ever the answer?

The Government has made the point that it is not possible to introduce term limits for abortion in the Bill because of the provisions of the Constitution. One aspect of this issue causes me great difficulty. That is where an abortion is permitted and the unborn child is around the viability threshold. A baby born now at 24 or even 23 weeks gestation stands a good chance of survival. However, we all know that premature babies can suffer from serious complications. I am deeply uneasy about the possibility of the State deliberately inducing the birth of a baby at such an early stage in the knowledge that by doing so the baby may well have profound lifelong disabilities or suffer from serious medical complications. While I hope this will never happen, the Bill opens up this scenario and I believe it is one with which most people would have a real difficulty.

I acknowledge that mental health has been the Cinderella of the health service for far too long. I acknowledge that suicide is pervasive in our society. In many ways, it is a silent killer and, as a people, we have not given it anywhere near the level of attention it deserves. I acknowledge that suicidal ideation among pregnant women can and does happen, albeit very rarely. I just do not believe intentionally taking the life of the unborn child is the answer, nor do the experts in psychiatry who have spent their lives studying and working in the field.

It is no secret that, from the outset, I supported a free vote for Fianna Fáil Deputies and Senators on the Bill. I did so because I believed the issue of protecting human life was an issue of personal conscience like no other. I was strongly of the belief no member of our parliamentary party should be able to impose his or her view on the Bill on another member of the party. That is my belief, irrespective of whether my view on the Bill is a majority or minority view within the parliamentary party. All parties should allow their members to vote in accordance with their conscience on this issue.

The Labour Party has long called for legislation to be introduced on the X case, but the same cannot be said for Fine Gael. In fact, during the last election campaign Fine Gael actively courted the support of those involved in the pro-life campaign on the basis that it would not introduce legislation on abortion. For that reason, I have enormous sympathy for the many Oireachtas Members within the Fine Gael Party who are deeply uncomfortable with the Bill. These Members went to the people and received their support on a Fine Gael platform of no abortion legislation. They now find themselves subject to a parliamentary Whip to support a Bill that their party promised it would not introduce. Regardless of whether one agrees with the Bill, that is deeply unfair to those Deputies and Senators.

I accept that the Bill will be passed by the Oireachtas, probably with a very large majority in this House. I ask the Government to monitor its implementation extremely closely.

As an opponent of the Bill, I have not subscribed to the view that the floodgates will open as soon as it is passed. However, the interpretation of the Bill and the practice of its implementation could well change over time. I am pretty certain they will.

Suicide is tragic in all circumstances. We heard evidence during the Oireachtas committee hearings that suicide among pregnant women is, I am thankful, extremely rare. The incidence is somewhere between one in 250,000 and one in 500,000 pregnancies.

Once the Bill is enacted, the Minister will need to assess the data coming through on the actual number of abortions being carried out. Over time, information on the number of abortions under this legislation will answer the question of whether we are moving towards a more liberal abortion regime on mental health grounds.

The Constitution provides for an equal right to life for the unborn and the mother. There are Deputies who wish to remove that clause from Bunreacht na hÉireann, but I disagree with them. There are those who believe the Bill is a stepping stone to a more liberal abortion regime. I hope they are wrong but genuinely fear they are right. I will be voting against the Bill for the reasons I have outlined.

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