Ruairi Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein) | Oireachtas source

Once upon a time, another job I did badly was as a security guard one summer – a highly trained security guard in my case. I was told you do not put your hand on anybody unless you think they can get a six-month sentence. I do not how you would work out in real time whether somebody would get a six-month sentence. We have all seen where the witnesses are dealing with a greater level of aggression and all the rest of it. They have security guards who are probably not paid huge money. It is particularly seen in hospital settings, never mind in shops, where you can be dealing with very chaotic characters. Someone like a security guard will probably not take that risk and the people at the other end are probably aware of that. It is an issue that needs to be addressed. I am not entirely sure. It is not like you can make people into an almost garda, as it were. I have seen it be an issue across the board.

The witnesses are talking about an increased amount of shoplifting. I have seen a huge amount. If you go through court reports, you will find it is the same names. In fairness, if you break them down individually, they are not crimes that will get a person a life sentence. These are probably chaotic people. I can think of a number of them. When they are not busy shoplifting, they are eating tablets and whatever else. It is a wider societal issue but the witnesses have to deal with it. I am not saying there is any way to absolutely police that. Wider issues need to be dealt with. In some of the cases I am talking about, you would also want a "Back to the Future" car and to have dealt with it 20 years beforehand. However, we are where we are. There needs to be some element of sanction, and chaotic circumstances need to be addressed. We also need to at least try to address it in relation to future generations. Sometimes, the problem for the witnesses is they will be dealing with these people head on. We can all talk about what needs to be done in respect of intergenerational trauma, addiction and mental health issues, but it is not always pretty when you have to deal with it in your shop and it is going off on one of your staff members.