Brendan Smith (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Cathaoirleach. Like previous speakers I welcome the professors back to our committee and thank them for the valuable contribution they have made to our committee's work over the years and at the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly as well.

As the Cathaoirleach said at the outset, there is huge emphasis on the need for educational attainment to be improved in Northern Ireland. One of the basic tenets of the paper the professors have produced is the lack of educational attainment and the loss of graduates. All of us, in our own way, have always advocated a greater movement North-South and South-North at higher education level. It is slightly out of this context, but over the years did students from Northern Ireland who came here to study by and large return? When students from Northern Ireland go to England, Wales and Scotland many unfortunately do not return, especially those from the unionist community. It is just a point of interest. Is there any data available on whether students who come from Northern Ireland to study in this State continue to live here or return? Again, education plays into the whole area of productivity. I recall reading some commentary that 21% of 30- to 34-year-olds have not completed post-primary education in Northern Ireland. If that is accurate it is a very high percentage of people not finishing second level. Our figure here is less than 10%, to my knowledge. It is generally given as 9%. The professors might comment on that as well. It shows the difficulty there is and the need, as was mentioned, for reform of the second-level education system to provide equality of opportunity. I sincerely hope we will see a new constitutional arrangement in future, namely, a united Ireland. I am realistic enough to know it will not happen as quickly as I or other people would like, but the people in our jurisdiction are by and large used to a good education system and would not want an inferior one in any part of our island.

I think that is a basic philosophy of most people who want to see education opportunities. I have been a beneficiary of free education and access to third level. I would not have had that opportunity were it not for the policies that were implemented from the late 1960s onwards. A huge proportion of Irish people are beneficiaries of that improvement. From that point of view, progress in the area of education is key to progress and productivity.

With every policy and strategy in place to improve productivity in Northern Ireland vis-à-visthe South, that will not happen overnight. What would be the optimal period within which to achieve equalisation in productivity? I assume we are talking about more than a decade.

I saw another figure quoted and I do not know how right it is. I understand why the witnesses' paper is based on the 2019 statistics. It is because of the transfers due to Covid-related problems. In Northern Ireland, in 2019, the revenue was £17.7 billion and the expenditure was £28.4 billion. That is a deficit of approximately €12 billion. If the Northern Ireland welfare rates were brought up to the prevailing rates in this State, that is, equalised and improved, a figure that has been put out in the public domain is that the subvention would be around €20 billion. The witnesses might comment as to whether or not that is accurate.

One thing the witnesses will have heard us speak about here in the past is the benefits of the all-Ireland economy. They will be familiar with the territory I represent. In a relatively undeveloped area, the central Border region, I and the people north of Cavan-Monaghan have seen at first hand the huge benefits since 1998 of the developing all-Ireland economy. That is often the unsung part of the Good Friday Agreement. It is not talked about enough. We had IBEC here some time ago in the context of meeting the architects of the Good Friday Agreement and reviewing the benefits of it. It is an area that is not quantified enough. So much has happened, despite the political challenges with institutions in Northern Ireland not being in place for a substantial part of that period, despite the huge international downturn and despite Covid. The all-Ireland economy in trade North and South has grown hugely and has had a benefit. Trade North-South has grown much more dramatically, to my knowledge, than trade South-North, but we are all beneficiaries of it. I think we want to continue to talk much more about the all-Ireland economy and the huge benefits we are deriving from it. I would like to see that talked up much more because it is a great credit to the businesspeople, the entrepreneurs and the people who have driven the all-Ireland economy. Without any political ideology, without flag-waving, without talking about new political structures, they have gone on and created jobs that are benefiting the communities that I, Pauline and others represent, the same as our Cathaoirleach and Senator McGahon. In a new constitutional arrangement, I presume there would be an even greater impetus given to that all-Ireland economy.

Those are just a few of the comments the witnesses might refer to in their response to me.